Job Discussion Forums

[Stephen Jones]

The WTO is the World Trade Organization. It is concerned with trade between countries, and has nothing to do with labour matters or anything else.

In order to be a member of the World Trade Organization Saudi needs I believe a clean bill of health from the ILO (International Labour Organization) in Geneva but it has been a member of that for many years.

Employment laws and protections for expatriate workers have basically been the same for the last twenty years or so. The problem, as elsewhere, is the difficulty in enforcement, and the fact that the employer is generally in a much stronger position in any dispute.

Whatever organizations Saudi joins there's not going to be one that enforces posters to internet forums to have the least idea what they are talking about. At least ignorance is one field where there is no discrimination here, either by gender, class or nationality.

[Cleopatra]

[cmp45]

[Queen of Sheba]

It's not as difficult as one would think for workers to file for non payment anymore. Local laws may not have changed in the last twenty years, and I dotn claim to know or understand them, but their enforcement seems to be improving, in some cases anyway. I will only speak about what I know. A worker who has not been paid goes to the local police station, assuming they can get out of the house, they say they have not been paid, present their iqama, and if their employer is their sponsor, they will be called into court within 30 days to prove they have paid. They can prove this in several ways, by showing bank transfers to the the employee's account, or with signed check stubs. We provide the latter to workers we have sponsored for these reasons.

[Cleopatra]

I would imagine that many low-grade workers don't even have bank accounts for their salaries to be paid into. Beside, you are overlooking the fact that such vulnerable people would likely be ignorant of whatever laws exist in the first place, and would probably be terrified of filing such a suit, even assuming they have time off during working hours or can even afford the taxi fares. I also am sorry to say that I do not have the slightest confidence that the Saudi authorities would take seriously complaints from Indian street sweepers. I hope I'm wrong here, but unfortunately I don't believe I am.

[Queen of Sheba]

I have met many maids with bank accounts, here in Saudi and in their own countries. I have also had contact with a maid who filed and was paid because her employer could not prove that she had indeed paid her. The irony behind all of this is that the employer, an elderly woman from a well off family, says she did pay her and that she filed just to get more money out her before her contract expired. After knowing the old lady for several years, and seeing her interactions with her maid as well as other workers, I am inclined to beleive her.

The problems with workers rights clearly exist, but to be fair, the dubious behavior goes both ways. While the recourse that the workers have in KSA is limited, and Saudis certainly prefer Saudis over workers, my point still stands that things seem to be improving, albeit slowly.

[Cleopatra]

[Queen of Sheba]

To be fair, it is not the Saudis abuse workers alone, expats have been known to do the same, and sometimes it�s the reverse. This is not uncommon, and its important to be fair and fair to those people who do try to be decent to the people they sponsor by acknowledging these things.

I wasn�t talking about burnt toast either, I am talking about organized robberies, adultery, murder, black mail and poisoning. Sadly, most Saudis I have spoken with on the topic have all been victims of petty theft, even after they have been fair and provided all that they are supposed to and beyond for their maids and drivers. While it can be said that their employees� salaries are so low that this is understandable, they signed contracts and theft is a crime should never be �justified.�

I am not saying things should not be improved as far as workers rights are concerned, just that there are many things to be considered before assuming that workers are always abused and never the abusers. Workers have also been known to get even, or just take advantage of the "rich Saudi who wont notice or care" and it�s not always on the Saudi sponsor who abused them, ironically. It is all a very nasty cycle and it does need to be addressed, and further law establishment and further law enforcement would be a good place to start. All such related criminal and abusive behavior exists in Saudi Arabia, not only the fact that workers don�t have proper assistance and representation.

[trapezius]

Someone is living in fantasy land here:

[Queen of Sheba]