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What Burdick and Lederer were trying to say in that book....

 
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mdk



Joined: 09 Jun 2007
Posts: 425

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 5:48 am    Post subject: What Burdick and Lederer were trying to say in that book.... Reply with quote

I notice that somebody started a thread about a certain catch phrase arising from a book written by Burdick and Lederer (If I recall the authors correctly). MOD EDIT Perhaps - if you will excuse my cautious circumlocution - I can cast some light on what I believe the poster was trying to say and why it is germane to this forum.



Here's a quote from the wikipedia article...

Quote:
In the context of this novel, the title alludes to both positive and negative attributes of its characters. The authors state that one of the "good" characters is "ugly" looking to create a contrast with the "bad" characters who were "handsome" . In the book, the authors' "good" characters used their skills and resources to make a positive change in the lives of villagers in Southeast Asia and the "bad" characters used their skills and resources for other purposes. For example there is an "ugly" engineer who helps villagers with an irrigation system, and a "handsome" Ambassador who does not care about what happens to the people on the village level. The novel weaves many separate stories with these kinds of counterpoints of an "ugly American".



I think the intent of the original post was to say the author felt he was one of the "good", "ugly" examples of American ex-pats.

I felt the same way too when I was working in Russia. Just before I first went in, the Russian government had nixed a plan to send peace corps volunteers into Russia as english teachers. Even with my limited knowledge of the culture at that time, I realized it was not going to be well received.

Whatever I may have accomplished as a teacher, I will always be pleased to remember that I lived among those people riding the trolleybus and demonstrating that not all Americans come from the same stamp. I think that is germane to ESL in that how can you teach a language if the students think your culture consists of knuckle-dragging, opportunistic cretins?
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Sheikh Inal Ovar



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 1208
Location: Melo Drama School

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MOD EDIT

From my distant memory of it, it highlighted how the US lost to Soviet Russia certain aspects of the diplomatic war in Asia ... through their on the ground naivety ...

Where the Americans went in with a blueprint plan of US assistance and not a lot else ... the Soviets went in with a tailor made plan backed up with knowledge of local customs, language, and sensitivity ...

So I agree that many entering TEFL might benefit from the book ... especially those who believe the false assumption that 'My actions are good if my intentions are good'
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Sheikh Inal Ovar



Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 1208
Location: Melo Drama School

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you change your post while I was writing mine ...
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Mr. Kalgukshi
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Joined: 18 Jan 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To the extent this thread remains teaching and job-related, it will continue to be active. To the extent that it degenerates into something else including but not limited to politics, other off-topic postings, flaming, trolling or other inappropriate postings, it will become inactive.
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mdk



Joined: 09 Jun 2007
Posts: 425

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Sheikh,

Yes, I looked it over and had a pentimiento I guess. I had not rememered the correct authors and then saw a way to say what I wanted to say more concisely.

As to the edits from the moderator. That sounds good to me.
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furiousmilksheikali



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1660
Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would Graham Greene's The Quiet American be along these lines?
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Pavel



Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:14 pm    Post subject: Re: What Burdick and Lederer were trying to say in that book Reply with quote

mdk wrote:
I think the intent of the original post was to say the author felt he was one of the "good", "ugly" examples of American ex-pats.


Spot on MDK. I should have taken the American out and replaced with ex-pats.

Understanding norms of the host nation's culture facilitates teaching and learning.
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mdk



Joined: 09 Jun 2007
Posts: 425

PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2007 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps it depends a lot more on the culture.

In Russia, I was one of less than a dozen Americans in a town of about 500,000 so I stood out a great deal more - since the town had been closed for 70 years to foreigners. I always felt people were watching me out of the corner of their eyes.

I think the thrust of "The Ugly American" was that people to people contacts were much more useful than government programs - at least for some things.

"The Quiet American" was a good book. Greene was a bright criticizing Americans and he comes off a bit toffee-nosed when read by an American. Burdick and Lederer are a bit more palatable to me with their hard truth. Also making bicycle bombs by the CIA (as in "The Quiet American) seemed touchingly ludicrous back in the day.

It is interesting to note - as a side bar - that yesterday we had a series of demonstrations by the Hmong to protest the arrest of General Vang Pao for plotting to subvert the government of Laos. I watched the Hmong picket line in front of the court house and remembered when we had our anti Viet-Nam war demonstrations in the same spot when there were no Hmong refugees. Then I thought of how they had pro-war demonstrations there to "support our troops".

It made me glad I was an ESL teacher.

Quote:
For those things do most pease me,
which befall preposterously!
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