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EOE, M/F/D/V ???
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But if you have to be a US citizen it is quite clearly NOT Equal Opportunities !
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A US company is not compelled to offer equal hiring opportunities to non-citizens.

Last edited by globalnomad2 on Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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ootii



Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 124
Location: Riyadh, Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

globalnomad2 wrote:
They posted the ad that way because it ran in the US and you simply cannot post discriminatory job ads in the US.


Yes. The Internet is US sovereign territory because Al Gore invented it.
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's an irrelevant and silly comment. The issue has nothing to do with the internet, as labor laws regarding job ads came in long before the internet and applied at first to newspaper/journal ads.

Your comment is also inaccurate. Anybody can post anything they want on the Internet, including discriminatory job ads, as long as the latter are not by US-based employers hiring in the US.


Last edited by globalnomad2 on Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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Cleopatra



Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You're assuming that there is something illegal about saying "men only" or "women only" in job adverts.


Well, I believe this is illegal in certain countries, no?

Quote:
What is more astonishing is "Saudis preferred" for EFL posts.


I don't find that remotely astonishing. Many state-run places are under pressure to hire as many Saudis as possible, including for teaching jobs. This is particularly true for women's colleges and schools.

BTW I think it's worth pointing out here that many countries have laws forbidding discrimination in advertising and recruiting for jobs. It is by no means exclusive to the US. Whether such laws have much effect on the reality of the job market, whether in the US or elsewhere, is another question entirely.
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cleo is absolutely right. In the real world, employers discriminate in all sorts of ways. I had arguments with my Malaysian-Chinese wife, who believes employers shouldn't hire fat people because she believes if you're fat you must be too lazy and undisciplined to take care of yourself.

Still, hiring laws are needed. They do have a positive effect. I believe they trickle down into the culture that discrimination is bad. Moreover, habitual flouting of hiring laws can result in massive and successful class-action lawsuits against employers.
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MIKEBUCHAN



Joined: 18 Mar 2007
Posts: 106
Location: Russia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:09 pm    Post subject: ? Reply with quote

I think some of you just like to argue and nit pick moot points of different culture/nationality/laws and the like.

I believe that I answered the question in the second or third post to answer the OP's asking about all the abbreviations. And I have read that vieledsentiments and globalnomad2 have done a very good job of enlightening all of you.

However, I still see an attitude to angatonize.............

Mike
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. In any case, NYC or San Francisco are far more cosmopolitan than Edinburgh or Glasgow. And "USAnals" as Scot47 puts it in his inimitably bigoted way, are not all provincial yahoos, even those who haven't traveled that much. Let's see a little more analysis here and less bigotry.
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Longton



Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Chinese government has minimum height requirements for people wishing to join their diplomatic service. This is so non-Chinese diplomats, particularly those from western countries, can't look down on the Chinese and make them feel inferior. British police used to have minimum height requirements but in the era of political correctness I think the requirements have been removed.
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes...well all East Asian countries can discriminate in any way they want, as long as it is not against a Muslim (in Malaysia and Indonesia). All flight attendants in Asian airlines must be young and pretty. I was just in Manila for a visit...hotels require their front-desk clerks to be under 25 and basically beautiful models. You can see this in writing at, for example, the Richmonde Hotel web site. The same seems true for the rest of East Asia.
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ootii



Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 124
Location: Riyadh, Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

globalnomad2 wrote:
Anybody can post anything they want on the Internet, including discriminatory job ads, as long as the latter are not by US-based employers hiring in the US.


The advert we are talking about was not posted "in the US"; it was posted on Dave's ESL Cafe.
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, Lord. Dave's is a US-based web site. The ad was posted by a US company and designed primarily for US citizens. Why is that so hard to understand? If you wish to place a discriminatory ad on Dave's to hire people from outside the US to work for a non-US employer, you can do that. Otherwise if you are a US entity hiring from the US, you open yourself to civil and possibly criminal lawsuits if your ad is discriminatory.
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ootii



Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 124
Location: Riyadh, Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

globalnomad2 wrote:
Oh, Lord. Dave's is a US-based web site.


Ohmygod! You're right:

Server: forums.eslcafe.com
IP Address: 207.171.1.6
Organization: PacificNet
Country: United States
City, State: Winnetka, CA

I should have known better. A Brit working in the Emirates would naturally have a US based host. I will try not to make any more wild assumptions in the future.
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globalnomad2



Joined: 23 Jul 2005
Posts: 562

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take comfort in pretending the UAE is still part of the now-defunct British Empire. It is, defacto--if one can believe a newspaper account I read that said some quarter-million Brits will be living in their Dubai condos by the end of the decade?? Seems like a fanciful number to me. And if it isn't, I hope all those people realize that buying a condo in Dubai is one thing but selling it later is quite another. But that's a topic for another day.
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ootii



Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 124
Location: Riyadh, Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

globalnomad2 wrote:
Take comfort in pretending the UAE is still part of the now-defunct British Empire. It is, defacto--if one can believe a newspaper account I read that said some quarter-million Brits will be living in their Dubai condos by the end of the decade?? Seems like a fanciful number to me. And if it isn't, I hope all those people realize that buying a condo in Dubai is one thing but selling it later is quite another. But that's a topic for another day.


I can understand why some people may want to retire in Saudi Arabia, but what on earth is the appeal of the Emirates?
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