Job Discussion Forums

[Pieface]

It seems that alot of people have made the move from Japan to Hong Kong but I'm thinking about doing it the other way round when my contract expires in July. Would it be wise to try and get on the JET scheme...or look elsewhere? It seems that JET offers the most amount of pay to foreign language teachers (which is still substantially lower than NET!) - Are there any other options? International schools perhaps?
Cheers in advance for any help!

[ChrisRose]

The important factors to take into account are any differences in the cost of living.

I have not been to Japan for 16 years, but I recall it was expensive for things like food, although rent will be a tad cheaper.

Without exception, all the teachers I knew supplemented their incomes by teaching privately. Whilst technically illegal they all were more than happy to do so.

As for living in Japan, personally, I loved it! It was an alien experience. A rather alien society with rituals for everything from buying something from 7/11 to catching a train.

Due to it�s fast pace of live and relatively cramped life style the Japanese have created a wealth of entertainment of every conceivable description, all hidden in nooks and crannies awaiting you to stumble on it.

As with all ELT, you will find there are different levels of professionalism with differential pay. It�s really a question of learning what the salary range are outside of the World of shoddy private sector language schools. International schools exist, perhaps you could e-mail a few to get a better idea or try the Japan forum on Dave�s?

I wish you all the best and hope that you get to experience Japan.

Chris

[Pieface]

Thanks for the comments, Chris

[saigo]

Hi Pieface,

I would suggest you apply to JET. I'm presently on my 3rd year and I think it's a really good job to have in Japan. The JET salary is tax free, and most of the time your rent is subsidized, sometimes it's even completly free.

Depending on where you are placed, you will have very little work to do. The biggest complaint I hear from teachers is that they feel unfulfilled in their job because they have so much free time in the day!

The application process is lengthy, and you don't really have a say as to where you will be placed... But, I think it's a small price to pay for the job you get...

If you have any more questions, I'll do the best I can to answer them.]]

Saigo

[dodgee]

Having done three years in Japan on the JET Program, and then another year there on a private contract and now three months in Hong Kong (I know I am probably still in the honeymoon period) I would have to suggest that you do not apply for JET. JET is good if you have not lived overseas before, taught before, or have few prospects post-university. I had done all that but luckily I have a great personal life so the 'pulling teeth' aspect of being an ALT was bearable.

Living in Japan is great though so try and get a job with an International School. The pay is higher than the JET program(but still far lower than HK). Even more if you are well qualified and experienced(and you have to be if you are on the NET scheme). The job is much more professionally rewarding and YOU can be selective as to where you live and work.

Good luck!

[Pieface]

thanks alot, that's a great help!

[poof]

I think you can already get a lot of 'Japan' in HK, though - restaurants, Sogo, Daiso!

Personally, I found everything in HK so much easier. There's always a familiar English speaking person around each corner. Hong Kong was built for Westerners. I reckon going to Japan AFTER HK would be an awkward transition, everything seeming to go a step backwards in terms of ease of living as a foreigner. You will also notice less dynanism in learning English in Japan. 90% of the population struggle to make a sentence in English. Waiting for the first English words out of someone's mouth takes a lot of patience - do you have that? People are often reticent to face a foreigner, and everything is really expensive in Japan. However, if you're in a small town in Japan, there'll be no highrises or crowds to be seen, and you'll be treated like a celebrity. Could be fun if you want a bit of eccentricity.

Overall, what am I saying? I think you can't go wrong experiencing life in Japan, but I think you can expect some frustrations about the way business is conducted there when having been used to HK.

[ironopolis]

[skreee]

Hi Pieface,

This is more or less going to be stream of conciousness with no real organization. I'm going to ramble, but hopefully you'll be able to pick through it all and get some useful information out of it.

As a disclaimer, I've never lived in HK (the reason I found your post is because I'm on the forum looking for info about teaching in HK) but I did spend three years as a JET in Sapporo (1999-2002). You can see it's been about four years since I was there, so don't necessarily take what I have to say as gospel since some things may have changed in my absence.

Jet is by far the most hassle free (well, as hassle free as you can get in Japan) English teaching position I know or heard of. They take care of all the logistics, including housing and airfare both ways. The reason they provide this support is because a large number of ALT's (Assistant Language Teachers, what teachers go by in Japan on the JET program) are fresh out of uni and often have little to no experience living or even traveling abroad. It's so easy, it's almost silly. However, there can be a negative side to this... because the ALT's are often so young and inexperienced and also quite often lack any real teaching credentials or experience, those organizing the program as well as the Japanese teachers you would be working with can be at times patronizing in their attitudes towards you, which can be tiresome if you aren't that 21 year old still wearing his mortarboard when he lands in Tokyo, but someone with a few years living abroad and teaching under his belt. I was freshly graduated from uni when I landed, but I was also 25 years old with no experience living abroad, so it was a bit annoying, but at the time I was willing to sacrifice a bit of freedom to have someone arrange everything for me.

The money is good. When I was there, the standard monthly salary was $300,000/mo. or 36,000,000/yr. (Yen, obviously) which was on average about 50,000 more per month than the people I knew working at private language schools. An extra $400/mo. USD is substantial for lifestyle reasons. One of the main complaints made by ALT's is that there is no allowance made for pay increases for renewing your contract beyond the initial year. My 36th paycheck was for the same amount as my first paycheck to the single Yen. And the monthly renumeration has been the same since the conception of the program. It is not based on global exchange rates, or Japanese inflation.

It's true that housing is always arranged for, usually subsidized, and sometimes even free. Though the free housing is more often than not for those who live in extremely rural areas. However, I've known cases where the deal even includes the free use of a car during the duration of the contract.

I heard a statistic once that well over half of ALT's get placed in small rural communities. Often this involves being the only foreigner in your town which means you'll probably be the only native English speaker as well. But this has it's benefits as well as it's drawbacks. I found that those who lived in the rural areas were able to learn the most Japanese as well as save the most money since there wasn't as much opportunity to spend and there were fewer expats to hang out with on a daily basis. Some loved it, others hated it, and one ALT committed suicide sadly.

However, in my case, I was in a city of 2,000,000+ people, and I had 20 ALT's living in the same apartment complex with me, so it was like the dorms at uni again. Lots of piss ups, sleep overs, etc... Very easy to get used to speaking primarily English, spending money, etc... But very very fun, and I made friends for life.

I was in the city, so I paid more than most ALT's for rent, but even so, my rent was only about 22,000 Yen a month, which at the time was just about $200 USD. It was a relatively spacious one bedroom apartment with a separate living room and a big kitchen (the kitchen I had was bigger than the one I have here in the US now!). I was responsible for a phone bill, gas bill, electric bill, internet bill, and monthly comprehensive, international health insurance. Only the health insurance and my rent were automatically deducted from my monthly salary. The insurance was spendy, about $350 a month, but you can't blame them for making this a mandatory item since ALT's travel all over the place, to all sorts of dodgey places, drinking etc... One even went on a skiing holiday to Austria or someplace and broke his neck (not too badly, he had to just spend some time in hospital and wear a neck brace for a while afterwards). Even though Japan is expensive, towards the end of my time in Japan when I suddenly panicked knowing I didn't have any plans or money saved up for my departure, I was able to save a thousand USD per month for the six months prior to my departure, and I still had a little (a little mind you) spending money every month. The wage is livable, and depending how frugal you are, you can save money.

The job you can expect to perform.... well lets just say you shouldn't have any expectations whatsoever. They will tell you what to do, and you will do it. But the overwhelming chances are it won't be difficult whatever it happens to be. the first year I spent traveling to 14 different middle schools, spending as little time as one week and even up to a month at any given school. I taught anywhere from 1 class a day, to 5 a day depending upon who organized my schedule for me. I probably spent an average of about 5 actual hours a day at school, often allowed to leave early after my last class or after lunch whichever came first. Though this may sound like a doss, and believe me, it was... it was also a wonderful experience for me because it was relatively stress free and I had ample time to explore my surroundings during my first year abroad, and I wouldn't have had it any other way.

Then I was offered a position at a high school for the following year which I accepted because I was getting tired of figuring out the best bus route to get to each successive school (probably the most stressful part of my job now that I think about it). When I got to the high school I was expecting to assume advanced duties because of what I had heard from other ALT's also teaching at high schools. So I arrived on the first day with my "can-do" had on my head, but over the first month at the school the teachers at the school motivated me to be unmotivated. I was relegated to reading word lists in front of class for "pronunciation practice". That, sadly, was my main responsibility. Although I did elect to start an after school English club and I also coached the speech team as well. High schools in Japan are tracked. The academic level of my school was very high, and so 99% of my students were university bound, and they were all dong nothing but preparing for college entrance examinations, and so there wasn't any time to dilly-dally with anything else I had in mind. So I spent most of the year making friends among the teachers, talking with students in Japanese and English, reading newspapers, drinking tea and coffee, and making (to the daily, undying amusement of my fellow staff members) cheese sandwiches. I wish I could have done more, but I could tell they would have thought I was getting in the way of the success of the students (i.e. their passing their uni exams).

However, I had other friends who were given free-reign in the classrooms to do whatever they wanted to.

And all of this transpired in an urban setting... I hear the teaching situations can be quite different in rural areas. It's all case-by-case.

I'm a pretty go-with-the-flow kind of guy, so most of it didn't bother me too much, but some of my friends, who were highly qualified in TEFL (certificates and masters degrees) were really frustrated with the lack of control in the classroom. But like I said, it all depends on the situation, and what you're able to make of it.

I hear that one thing that isn't allowed is for JET applicants to apply from outside their countries. I'm not sure where you're from, but let's say you're from the UK, then you'd have to return to the UK, and apply from there. And the application process starts around October and lasts about 9 months until the time you find out where you're being placed (assuming you get the position). You might not think this would be such a problem, just mail the application to someone at home who puts it in a new envelope and mails it to Japan for you so that there is the proper postmark on it, but all the correspondence they send you will have to go to an address in your country, and the interview, if you're granted one, will be in your home state (or the nearest interview site). And there is a pre-departure orientation you'd have to participate in just before you leave in the city where you were interviewed. And a fairly thorough medical exam has to be made as well that includes blood tests and a chest x-ray. Finally, they arrange for a ticket for you from your chosen departure city to Japan. I don't believe they're willing to make any kind of arrangements for flights from a third country to Japan. In fact, I remember I arrived in Portland, Oregon to attend my second pre-departure orientation one day before my flight to Japan, and the organizer took all of our passports so that they could stamp the insides with the proper, one-year, instructor's visas only to be given back to us along with our business class air tickets (which I hear they don't do anymore... now everything is coach) AT the airport just before the flight. As I said they take care of everything, and really don't make many if any exceptions.

So if it's something you really want to do, you'd probably have to return home and wait around for nine months, which may not be such a bad thing depending upon how long you've been away from friends, family, and your favorite old watering holes.

I'm not sure what else to include. I've actually done some amateur-informational seminars about JET for my classmates during my current TESL master's program, so I do have more information about JET if you have more specific questions. If so, just ask, and I'd be happy to let you know what I know.

Regards,

Eric Hall

[jammish]

[aineoc]

I would really like to make the case for living in Okinawa, Japan. I was there for three year on the JET programme and it was the most amazing experience. Okinawan JETs for the most part seemed to really love their time on the island. Many stay on for 4th year positions. Everyone left Okinawa, although maybe not as better teachers, but with a new interest or a deep love for the people there. The climate is great and you have ample oppurtunity to dive, snorkel and pursue whatever interests you have. It is alot more relaxed than the mainland. I urge you to look into applying for a JET position there if this is what takes your fancy.

[fluffyhamster]

[buddhaboyjp]

I lived in Japan a little over 16 years, and like anyplace you go, there are the ups and downs, with possibly more downs.

Life there is MORE expensive, even in a fairly small city like Fukuoka.
Yes, you do get paid more, but you also spend more.

If you a man, than it could be a female paradise for you.
If you are woman, than it could be heaven or hell.

I do miss the onsens and some of the foods and shinto shrines, but other than that, you're better off here in Hong Kong.

I've been here since April '07, and I'm loving it.
And yes, I am taking notice of the Downs.

If you are seriously going, try Fukuoka.
It has everything you want and need, without the Tokyo crowds.

Good luck

[Serious_Fun]