Job Discussion Forums

menso35 · Joined: 27 Oct 2007 Posts: 51

I have tried using the search function but I am coming up with mixed, and oftentimes, dated responses.

As of today, November 3rd, 2007, is there any official consensus concerning teaching on an F visa? The school where I took my TEFL course seems to think that it is just fine and dandy to do so, at least in that particular province. However, I have heard from other sources that it's illegal.

In particular I am curious about the Guandong province. Your insight would be highly appreciated. I apologize if this is totally redundant.

I just want to make sure the school I am courting is not blowing smoke up into a very dark area in my posterior region.

Kram · Joined: 20 Sep 2005 Posts: 152 Location: In a chair

To my knowledge, you can 'lecture' on an F visa. However, it's illegal to receive payment..

So, if they pay you, the law is being broken...by you and them.

As I was once informed, 'It's a very serious matter to break the law of the People's Republic of China'.

If I�m wrong, I'm happy to stand corrected..

tw · Joined: 04 Jun 2005 Posts: 3898

beck's · Joined: 06 Apr 2003 Posts: 426

I teach at a public university. I came here on a 90 day F Visa. The FAO turned this into a Foreign Expert's Certificate and a Residence Permit for Foreigners in the People's Republic of China. This permit is multiple entry and I am assured that I am teaching legally. It is a public institution so I believe the FAO.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

Beck

latefordinner · Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Posts: 973

Beck's, do you know how to tell when an FAO is lying? His lips are moving. I'm glad your employer managed to get you an RP, but normally this is impossible unless you have a Z. Well it seems that in China, rules are meant to be broken, and if a school has the connections and wherewithal, anything is possible. For every story such as yours however, there are a dozen or more where the school promised a Z and RP but couldn't or chose not to deliver.
An official consensus? Umm, wouldn't that be akin to a popularly elected emperor? Well if the Americans can do it then so can we. Lets just remember that whatever consensus we as foreign teachers reach as to what can or might or should or would better be means nothing; the authority of a couple of gangsters in suits sharing drinks in a KTV means everything. That is the country we've chosen to live in and the business we've chosen to do.

beck's · Joined: 06 Apr 2003 Posts: 426

I was suspicious when I came on an F visa this time around. I made a posting here in which I wrote about my suspicions.

It seemed to have worked out okay for me though. They turned my F into a Foreign Experts Certificate and Residence Permit after a medical exam. I was all prepared to get a Z abroad. I had done my medical and had all the forms filled out. I came to China on a Z my first time around but this time they told me that an F was okay. I checked with the other foreign teachers and they told me they all came on an F except one teacher who came on a tourist visa. We all have Experts Certs and RPs now though.

The guys at the FAO are party members. As I previously stated I work at a public uni so they must have pull with the local government. I would have never come on an F if I was planning on working for a private outfit. I figured that a public uni was in fact an arm of the government

kungfucowboy83 · Joined: 25 Jan 2006 Posts: 479

as someone said you can work on an f-visa you just can't be paid for it. there are a few legal loopholes such as getting the money paid into a foreign (not chinese) bank acount ect.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

menso35 · Joined: 27 Oct 2007 Posts: 51

Clear as mud as they say. So I guess I was illegal when I was working on the F and getting paid by the private school. I will definitely settle for nothing less than a Z visa next time!

I think China is more about connections, trading favors, and rapport building than anything else.

It's really weird about how they enforce their laws so unevenly. I used to live in this city where evil, no good foreigners would sit outside bars and smoke this bizarre green substance which kind of smelled like a skunk. They would start laughing and then a little later would order all of this food from the restaurant down the street then devour the food like they hadn't eaten in years. Could they have been using that horrible substance that ruins lives and causes insanity and murders?!? I mean, after I saw that movie reefer madness I would never even think of going near that evil stuff! Anyways, the the local 5-0 would cruise by, smile, take a whiff, look at the foreign devils and just keep walking. They couldn't care less! Damn them! Those evil people should be punished to the fullest extent of the law. Why were the Chinese police so derelict in their duties?

malu · Joined: 22 Apr 2007 Posts: 1344 Location: Sunny Java

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

Malu, you are becoming a poetic genius. Thanks for saying my thoughts so much better then myself. You did a piece over on the off-topic that I wanted to use for your laureate nomination, but now I can't remeber which thread it was.

Keep it coming

malu · Joined: 22 Apr 2007 Posts: 1344 Location: Sunny Java

The whole F/L/Z visa question reminds me of the philosophers' union's demands when they went on strike in a certain Douglas Adams book:

'We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!!'