Job Discussion Forums

h-train · Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:49 pm Post subject: Hong Kong Opportunities

Hello. This is my first post on this board. Usually I post on the Korea side as I live over here right now. I am presently surprised at how cool and laid-back you guys are on this side; it's completely unlike the flame-fest that is the Korea board.

I have been doing lots of searches through old posts but can't find that much. I lived in Guangzhou for 2 years before moving to Seoul and now I am dying to get back to Guangdong. A few years ago I wanted to apply for positions in Hong Kong but a couple people told me it's impossible unless you are a fully certified teacher in your native country. It seems that is not true after further review.

I have a master's in international business, a TEFL, an undergrad in Mandarin, 3 years' experience teaching English, and 6 years of prior language training (not English.) Does this in fact qualify me to teach in Hong Kong? Can I qualify for the NET program with these cridentials?

Thank you very much in advance.

h-train · Posted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 2:02 pm Post subject:

My search function isn't giving me the white screen anymore and I found in the info I was hoping to find. My plan is to get a real TESOL before heading over in the summer. If anyone has any extra advice I would be thankful for that.

articulate_ink · Joined: 06 Mar 2004 Posts: 55 Location: Hong Kong

Your credentials surpass mine and I'm doing my damnedest to find a job in Hong Kong (I'm also in Korea and counting the minutes until I can get out)... there are a number ads for the NET program in the job listings here, so you can check out the qualifications if you haven't already. You should be fine. Good luck.

h-train · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 1:46 am Post subject:

articulate_ink · Joined: 06 Mar 2004 Posts: 55 Location: Hong Kong

Yeah, I think there's going to be an exodus from Korea, starting, well, last week? The 3-month grace period on the new immigration regs is helpful, and perhaps the whole thing will be scaled down even more before my contract is up. That said, I'm tired of living in a place where being an expat is likened to being a criminal. Not only would I not recommend that people come here, I've also talked a few of them out of it. I could go on, but you get the idea. My big concern right now is that the collapse of NOVA in Japan and this latest batch of state-sponsored xenophobia from Korea (aka Kimchistan) is resulting in a lot more competition than I'd normally have faced. My resume's not bad but plenty of people have better ones. *sigh* Anyway, good luck again...

Horizontal Hero · Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:35 pm Post subject:

The key for the NET system is the postgrad dip.ed. You can get into primary on less, but your pay rate is capped at a relatively low level. If you go for the "real TEFOL", get the Dip. ed. It will be worth it, trust me. Sadly in this world, experience doesn't count till you have the bit of paper. As far as I know a masters/PhD in linguistics or any qual which does not have the practical teaching component does not qualify. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

And h-train, try the China job-related and off-topic forums for info on the mainland. You can get lots of good info there (though I don't post there anymore, myself).

11:59 · Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:03 pm Post subject:

Serious_Fun · Joined: 28 Jun 2005 Posts: 1171 Location: terra incognita

articulate_ink · Joined: 06 Mar 2004 Posts: 55 Location: Hong Kong

To get the full picture, it would help if you spend some time browsing the job discussion forum over in the Korea section. But if you're only interested in the quick-and-dirty version, here's my take on it.

Do you remember the Canadian pedophile who was arrested in Thailand a couple of months ago? He had been living and teaching in Korea at the time. The new visa regs are basically anti-foreigner backlash. Some of the requirements, such as a criminal background check, make sense. If you're going to work with kids, absolutely. But that's the only defensible part; then we start getting into some grey areas, and the red flags start waving. The health screening is understandable in a country with nationalized health care, but the Koreans didn't stop there: there are specific questions about alcoholism (in this soju-puke-splashed country? PLEASE), drug use, mental illness, and a few other things. The whole thing was also couched in overwrought, xenophobic language about how many foreigners are here illegally, teaching on falsified credentials, bringing social problems to Korea, and so on. We're also supposed to get those background checks apostilled, which is not easy to accomplish from the other side of the planet. And we're supposed to provide both our original diploma and, I believe (one loses track) an apostilled copy. All this, even to RENEW a work visa. For a while there was also talk of requiring E-2 visa holders to have face-to-face interviews at Korean consulates in our home countries. For a while, before Immigration cleared that one up, it seemed that even changing jobs here would require a trip out of the country for that... back to Canada or the US or wherever. That has been scrapped. Oh, and the date for the new regs to come into force was originally Dec. 15, which left a lot of people absolutely no time to jump through all the required hoops. There's now a 3-month extension.

Many people in the Korea forums think this is all just an election-season tactic, and now that the election's over, the whole thing will quietly fade away. On the other hand, it smacks of overt, institutionalized xenophobia. It's also infuriating, given the number of times many people have had to verify their educational credentials. I've been here 2 1/2 years and have already provided the degree and sealed transcripts 3 times that I can recall. Koreans are famous for their utter, perfect lack of organization, and when you factor that in, the whole situation begins to look like a hopeless and insulting kcufretsulc.

A lot of people are bailing and I am one of them. I was planning to leave even before this happened, and now I'm pretty much counting the minutes.

Horizontal Hero · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:33 am Post subject:

I certainly did find a bad vibe when I was in Korea. However if you hate providing your quals and docs repeatedly, Hong Kong is certainly not the place to come! Evil or Very Mad

And disorganisation? I doubt the Korean system could be much more of a chook farm than what the EDB (Ed Dept) boys are running here.

PS For non-Australians, a "chook farm" is a chicken farm. Laughing

11:59 · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:54 am Post subject:

I have to say that I agree wholeheartedly with HH. If you are seeking refuge from institutionalised xenophobia, infuriating bureaucracy, and blatant disorganisation, then if I were you I'd steer well clear of HK for the place epitomises all three such concepts. Many people here have to re-supply certificates and references (often to the tune of proving which primary school they attended) etc. even when they renew a contract with the same employer, and we are all but token gweilos, no matter what our qualifications and experience.

Kaloi · Joined: 01 Aug 2007 Posts: 53

h-train · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:20 am Post subject:

Thanks for the advice to everyone who has posted. Pardon my ignorance but I'm not quite sure what a Dip Ed is; I'm guessing that's a teaching licensure in Oz? I have decided that if I am not admitted to the NET scheme, and don't find a suitable job before my contract here in Korea is up, I'm going to bite the bullet and get licensed in America. Hopefully it won't come to that, but it would be nice to have and be a bit of insurance for the future.

Horizontal Hero · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:52 pm Post subject:

h-train · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 12:11 am Post subject:

Ah, that's the same as our secondary/primary teacher licensure. I called my university today and it's either a 1 year full time or 2 year part time program. The thought of going back to America for that long really makes me nauseaous, but if it is the only option I will have to bite the bullet.

For those of you already working in Hong Kong, would you recommend that I go ahead and head back to get a Dip Ed/Licensure? Would it be worth it to sacrafice the year/boredom/money to get qualified?

Thanks again.