Job Discussion Forums

[ktodba]

Apologies to the people who actually try to make things work work but I'm really getting disillusioned by the content put up here. I've served my time in private schools / hagwon hell and done DoS and centre managers jobs and now work in the state sector in the UK.
I have found some good things and a lot of bad things about Tefl but I never found anything that made me think I was owed a living.
Tefl gives the teacher a great opportunity to travel and experience new cultures if they chose to take it, if they chose to take the first offer that comes along and whine about it rather than trying to improve it then I'm afraid that I have no sympathy.
An individual's experiences in a country or company are just that, the experiences of an individual, treat them as such and get up and research for yourself. I currently work at a school that is exactly right for me but exactly wrong for some others, who's right? It depends on the person experiencing it. I like it because I can make a difference and am respected for trying to improve the lot of our students within a framework that makes sense to me. If I didn't like it I wouldn't have signed for the school.
At the end of the day I made a choice and have to live with it, people working in tefl should do the same. If you make a mistake then learn from it rather than whining about it. You joined a poor school because you didn't research it? Leave and put it down to experience and learn from it - NB: this doesn't mean do a runner!
I believe that life is about rights and responsiblities and that in order for us to get our rights and protect the rights of others we need to take care of our responsibilites for our our actions. Nobody forced me to sign the contract and I need to accept that i had free choice in my job.
After this rant I guess all I want to say is - stop whining about things and start trying to change them for yourself.

[johnslat]

Dear ktodba,
Apology accepted. However, I have to wonder just how long you've been a visitor here and how many posts you've read.
The reason for my wondering is that I've been here quite a while, and yet I haven't been so struck by the number of posts that exhibit much whining.
Most of the posts, it seems to me, consist of questions and of answers to those questions. Certainly there are some individuals who complain, but in "real life" on the job, it's been my experience that complaints are not so uncommon.
Besides, you don't really think that your "rant", as you called, it is going to suddenly transform any complainer into a stoic who will zip his/her lip and buckle down to effecting changes, do you? If so, you're much more of an optimist than I.
So, why exactly did you post your message? My guess is that is was to blow off some steam of your own. The irony, of course, is that in a way you're whining about whiners.
Well, I hope it at least made you feel a bit better. But I suspect a fair number of other posters will not take too kindly to be lectured in such a fashion.
Regards,
John

[denise]

Well, I agree to a large extent with the OP, although I wonder what prompted it. I get frustrated and a bit annoyed when people on this site, who by virtue of their presence on this site are likely EFL/ESL teachers, say that this job sucks, it isn't a valid career, etc., etc. I wonder... if I were to visit a website for doctors, would I see the same? Experienced doctors telling pre-med students that being a doctor really sucks? Not to bother getting trained, because anyone knows the simple truth that if you've got a headache you just need to take an aspirin?

This job is what you make of it. If you just want to take a year off from a career back home, fine. If you want to make a career of it, fine. Just do some research, get whatever level of training you need, be flexible, and don't expect everything to be perfect.

d

[spiral78]

I think the thing is that TEFL/TESL really does have at least two very distinct levels.

Newbies, which includes all those with even a couple of years of experience + basic certification.

Others - who probably started as newbs, then got hooked and had the resources to earn stronger qualifications.

For those who remain long-term (more than a couple of years, IMO) NEWBS - well, the angst is probably both correct, in terms of what a teacher can expect, and (heaven help me) deserved. Come on, guys...what kind of serious career can anyone expect with a 30-day training course???
This is NOT a professional level of experience or commitment, and does not necessarily lead to professional working conditions.

I honestly think there is a very large market niche for minimally-qualified teachers, and that's where abuses are far more likely to occur. Not only because there's a large supply of new teachers with equivalent credentials, but because we are also talking across countries and cultures, where employment conditions vary WILDLY, not only in our field, but also for expats across the board.

How can we talk seriously about 'standards' when we are working in a HUGE range of situations???

The kicker is that 'minimally-qualified' can include a decent basic cert + some few years of experience.

If a newb wants to make a serious career of TEFL/TESL - it's really essential to pursue paper qualifications in addition to experience.

For whatever my perspective might be worth.....
Flame away. I'll stand by it.

[markle]

[soapdodger]

Well said JohnSlat. Words right out of my mouth. As my signature used to say before they were abruptly removed: EFL - just made for whingers! Whinging about whingers? A case of oneupmanship perhaps? Incidentally, anyone seen anything quite as polite as an explanation about where our signatures went? I noticed that there was a post by a member asking much the same thing and it too abruptly disappeared! Not that I give a damn, but knowledge is power and politeness is free, eh?

[rusmeister]

Somebody put on that Don Henley/Eagles song "Get Over It"!

[TheLongWayHome]

[spiral78]

I think markle's point about some people with feelings of 'entitlement' is very relevant to the so-called whingers from the newbie sector. Though I don't think it's entirely confined to males We've had some women on the boards who were outraged at what they saw as discrimination against them by language school owners in various countries (one instance of a girl who wanted to know how to take out a discrimination lawsuit in Spain comes to mind especially).

It also seems to me that most of the teachers with actual professional qualifications don't whinge on a regular basis. That's obviously a subjective observation, but it leads to the poin that....

you get out of any job/career/profession what you put into it...over the long term, at least.

[ls650]

I think the comment about newbies versus 'others' is very much on the mark. Some people who enter this field as a way to travel and live in other countries are simply not cut out for teaching overseas. It's just unfortunate that the rest of us have to deal with their fall-out.

[fluffyhamster]

I'd be interested to know what's 'exactly right' (for ktodba at least) at his or her school, to know what makes a good position (for the benefit of any newbies reading). (Apologies if it's already been discussed somewhere in ktodba's other threads).

[sheeba]

What a yawn man?

Can't we turn this thread into a 'I chose,I saw. I went' success that any professional with any self respect would BOTHER(scuse the caps gaylords) to even tuning into.