Job Discussion Forums

[dynow]

1113,

your situation differed greatly from the person I am trying to help out now. mainly because my school is unprepared to hire an American and go through all the necessary paperwork to get an American a KB. I had to do most of it on my own. who I am trying to help right now though, my school has provided even less assistance. sad but true.

also, I know you're just trying to help, but....."I think he'll have to go to a non EU country like the Ukraine to get another 90 days on his visa." How will that help him??? What good will that do???

Again, his situation is different than what yours was. He cannot cross a border, get a new stamp, and come back to Poland with a fresh 90 days. The new law stipulates that if you enter the Schengen regions, you are aloud 90 days in a 180 day period. If he goes to Ukraine and then comes back the next day, or even a month later, he's still in violation. We've been discussing this exact issue throughout this entire thread. If the laws were the way they were for you and I, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

[dynow]

so he's filing his paperwork. not sure how, but the Immigration Office told him to file everything before the 90 days are up, and then he will need to get another stamp before he actually applies. I have no idea why they want him to do this because he will still be here illegal once his 90 days are up, but honestly, yet again, it doesn't surprise me. i told him "if they say do that and you will get your KB, just do it".

Poland is really in a world of it's own. Paperwork here is so completely undefined. It's good and it's bad......

[spiral78]

It's no help to point this out, but it's the same with the Czech officials. Depending on who, the day, the weather, and a million other factors, the rules change, bend, slide....

It seems to me that the best way to play the game is to be honest, even if you've got yourself inadvertently into some infraction of the 'rules.' Patience is key (as you know well!), and try, try, try.

Sometimes it seems as though brownie points are allocated for how many times they've seen you standing humbly in their lines.

[BeatRippa]

Hello,

I don't mean to get off-topic, but I just have a question about the "45 day limit" that's been mentioned in this thread. I plan to attend a CELTA course in Poland this summer, and I was hoping that I could find work afterwards. Since it will most likely be longer than 45 days from the time I arrive in Poland to when I find work, I was just wondering if this is still a good idea. Should I attend a CELTA course in a different country, such as Czech or Hungary, and then come to Poland so I have more time to become legal? Thanks for any info you may have!

P.S. It's nice to be on the board!

Jeff

[dynow]

rippa,

that all depends. how long would you be in Poland before you finished your CELTA?

will you be on a work permit or "own business"?

also, are you a native speaker?

[spiral78]

No, getting certified in a different Schengen zone country will not extend your legal time in Poland. You get 90 days automatically when you enter the zone, and shifting from country to country within it does not re-start the 90 days. Google 'Schengen zone' if you're unsure which countries are now within the zone. Czech Rep and Hungary are.

If you arrive in Poland and start your CELTA within week one, you will be finished in time to apply for a KB within a week or two after finishing - and in that time, you should probably be able to find an employer to support you.

You say 'summer', but the timing is obviously a bit critical. You'll want to be sure that you will be able to get job interviews within the week after you finish your CELTA. If you are finishing anytime in August, when everyone's on holiday, you'll be out of luck.

I'm not sure what dynow (who's usually pretty informative) is getting at this time...hmmm, I'll see if I can elaborate...
the first question is obvious - you'll need to arrive, finish your course, and find work within 45 days
I don't think you can tell what kind of work permit you will want until you've got a job lined up, which is very difficult to do from abroad - you'll need to be there to do this, most likely
and I suppose that your chances of getting hired swiftly increase with native speaker status.

[spiral78]

I'm not sure my previous post was entirely clear - you won't get an entry stamp for Poland when arriving there from the CR, for example, or any other Schengen zone country. That means your clock in Poland essentially starts ticking when you arrive in the zone.

However, HEY, OP!! This seems like a possible loophole for the 45 day thing - what if the guy in question arrived in elsewhere in the Schengen zone (probably not workable because he'll have a Polish stamp in his passport, right) and then travelled from a different zone country to Poland on a later date. When would the 45 days start??

[BeatRippa]

Thanks for the info everybody. Here's a little information about myself:

- 22 years old
- American
- will finish my M.A. in Human Resources Development in July
- I'm a military kid (I've lived in Germany, Belgium, Korea, Hawaii, etc...)
- I'm a native speaker
- I plan to attend the CELTA course at IH Krakow from August 25-September 19

Thanks for clarifying the Schengen issue Spiral.. I was planning to arrive early to sightsee, or to visit my friend in Germany before the course, but I guess I should just arrive in Krakow immediately before the course begins. If I understand correctly, however, it seems it IS possible get legal in this situation as long as I don't waste any time. I just don't want to end up like dynow's friend, who is hopefully doing better by now. Thanks!

[spiral78]

Yeah, your timing is pretty ok. Your CELTA providers can hopefully help you hook up interviews with reputable schools ASAP. Your quals sound strong, so you should probably be able to make it work.

If it were me, I'd tell my CELTA provider that I wanted to secure legal work (and papers) as soon as possible, and ask for their suggestions and whatever assistance they can give you.

[spiral78]

OH, and, by the way, if you're up for a summer holiday before starting, you could consider Croatia. It's non-Schengen, and a relatively short flight to Poland.

Like every holiday destination in Europe, it'll be wildly crowded in August, but it's an idea.

[dynow]

Spiral,

I'm not sure if I understood your post about the 45 day thing correctly but:

were you saying what would happen if he flew into another Schengen zone country before going to Poland, and when would the 45 day thing start ticking? if so, I think I see where you're going with this, but he would be pressed for time to get all the paperwork done before his 90 days were up. if he were to go to, say Germany for 15 days, then come to Poland, technically his Polish stamp would be starting with Day 1, so it may be possible.

with that said, my American friend whom I am helping out was still able to file his paperwork somehow (on day 86!), and get this...........this is a complete miracle...........his landlord who he has done nothing but complain about ever since he moved in........agreed to give him Zameldowanie. This is unheard of. My landlord just short of laughed at me when I requested this last year. Him getting Zam. in his own flat saves him a whole lotta' headache. I'm really happy for the guy that things are making a turn for the better and he may be able to see some light at the end of the tunnel.

[spiral78]

Great news!

Yeah, the 90/45 day thing seems like a very small possible loophole to me...I mean, if someone's schengen-zone entry was into, say, Germany and the passport stamp reflected something like July 1, and this person went to the Polish authorities on August 14 and said that he/she had just entered Poland that very morning and wanted to start KB processes- who could say?

But even if this proved to be a loophole, it's so small that it's unlikely to be any great benefit.

Anyway, I'm really glad your American was able to get his papers after all. He/she must be pretty grateful for your help!

[scottie1113]

what is Zameldowanie? My dictionary says registration, check in.

[dynow]

zameldowanie:

without it, you cannot start your own business. without it, you cannot get a residency card, unless your company hires you outright on a work permit, which fewer and fewer schools are doing these days because of all the peripheral costs involved.

Zameldowanie is registering yourself to a particular residence in poland. even Poles have to do this. it lets poland know where you live, work, pay taxes, etc. It is also a way for Poland to prevent landlords from collecting rent from foreigners and not paying taxes on the income.

Getting one is not easy, because most landlords will refuse to give it to you. You will need Zam. for your business location, your "office", which the building must be rated for that, and a Zam. for where you live, if you want a Karta Pubytu, or residency card. there's no other way around it.

with all the paperwork that is involved coming to Poland to work as an american, the 90/45 rule has really made it difficult because the first few weeks you are here, you need to make alot happen.

[spiral78]

Landlords aren't eager to give this out because then it becomes official that they have rental income and have to pay taxes on it. It's a time-honored tradition to avoid this tax if at all possible!