|
Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
hermes3x
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 22
Location: TX (For Now)
|
 Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 10:44 pm Post subject: CELTA sexiness in actuality? |
 |
|
So, after having gone through the CELTA-ification process, I am now ESL hardcore, WITH NO TEACHING EXPERIENCE. How'm I lookin?
Actually, is there a noticeable pay difference for teachers with the CELTA cert versus those who come into the market with other certifications? (I'm just stalling putting together my resume and applying!) This applies to teachers with little to no prior classroom experience
H3M |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
arioch36
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 3589
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 10:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| 99% of the time there is no difference, though you should always bargain, and can try using it to bargain for a little more |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: CELTA sexiness in actuality? |
|
|
| hermes3x wrote: |
So, after having gone through the CELTA-ification process, I am now ESL hardcore, WITH NO TEACHING EXPERIENCE. How'm I lookin?
Actually, is there a noticeable pay difference for teachers with the CELTA cert versus those who come into the market with other certifications? (I'm just stalling putting together my resume and applying!) This applies to teachers with little to no prior classroom experience
H3M |
if you have no experience in china or any other similar environment, you'll be in for a surprise. those model students and the teaching conditions you had on celta are almost non-existent in china. i found those instructors at ecc in bangkok had no idea what the real world of esl teaching was like, as a result, anyone leaving with a celta cert would be almost totally unprepared for the realities of teaching english in this country. still, the celta is better than nothing, but its pricey for what you get. experience is the big teacher here in china as far as i can tell.
no pay difference really. schools in china arent really concerned with qualifications other than the BA.
good luck anyway.
Last edited by 7969 on Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:15 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
11:59
Joined: 31 Aug 2006
Posts: 632
Location: Hong Kong: The 'Pearl of the Orient'
|
| Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
OP, I suggest you take the advice of the distracters with a pinch of salt, if not a whole shaker. A good, solid, globally-recognised pre-service course such as the CELTA, in addition to post-CELTA experience, will be a requisite to obtaining a decent (or semi-decent) TEFL post, and it does indeed make a difference as regards remuneration, as does a DELTA (which is what you should look towards a few years after completing your CELTA).
At the British Council in HK, for example (what I would term a semi-decent low-end TEFL post) a CELTA is essential:
http://www.britishcouncil.org/job_adv_for_lt_mar_08.pdf
In addition, for hourly paid contract work a CELTA gets you $377 HK per contact hour, and a DELTA $418:
http://www.britishcouncil.org/tehp_dec2007_jobad-3.pdf |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
7969
Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| 11:59 wrote: |
| OP, I suggest you take the advice of the distracters with a pinch of salt, if not a whole shaker. |
i suspect there might be many "detractors" on this thread if they care to take the time to reply.
| 11:59 wrote: |
| A good, solid, globally-recognised pre-service course such as the CELTA, in addition to post-CELTA experience, will be a requisite to obtaining a decent (or semi-decent) TEFL post, and it does indeed make a difference as regards remuneration, as does a DELTA (which is what you should look towards a few years after completing your CELTA). |
11:59, you say that a certification such as the celta will be necessary to get a half decent job but you dont clearly say where. if you're talking about europe or some of the esl markets other than mainland china i might agree with you. and in those other markets, you could likely squeeze some extra pay out of that qualification.
| 11:59 wrote: |
| At the British Council in HK, for example (what I would term a semi-decent low-end TEFL post) |
hong kong is only one very small part of the esl market and isnt indicative of mainland china in most respects. and there are plenty of decent esl jobs in china that do not require a celta. and how do you define a half decent job anyway? too many variables to consider.
the BA is the key here in china, and from reading another thread it looks like this guy wants to go to chengdu. if the schools there are like much of the rest of china, it's likely he wont be getting well-rewarded for the four weeks he spent on celta (if at all) and i bet most schools either wont ask for that certificate or wont know what is is when they see it (face it, the emphasis here is not on qualifications).
i dont mean to slag anyone who did the celta or any other tefl course (they can be useful in the right circumstances) but they're overpriced and in china at least, their utility is very limited. i wish i knew that before i spent the money... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
2 over lee
Joined: 07 Sep 2004
Posts: 1125
Location: www.specialbrewman.blogspot.com
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
7689 has is right. A CELTA is rarely of any help in mainland China, they are more interested in you having a degree and/or a pulse.
However it is important if you are going for a TEFL job in the UK, Australia, New Zealand - not sure about Canada, US. As far as I know they are more interested in your degree in Japan and Korea. In SOuth America they are mildy interested in you having a cert - but once again the CELTA is not always the preferred verison, unless you stike a British DOS
So it seems to me that the CELTA has rarely ever been heard of in mainland China. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kram
Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 152
Location: In a chair
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 6:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yes, I�m a dissident and agree with 7689. There was a thread a few weeks ago regarding certification. However, I'm still impressed with CELTA marketing and the fervour of its disciples.
CELTA/DELTA/TESOL/Uncle Jim's Online ESL Teaching Cert - they'd all have a similar impact on candidate �selection� in a Chinese run institution on the mainland. An alternative is to earn an MATESOL and then be rewarded with an extra 500 Yuan a month in a Uni. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
arioch36
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 3589
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:09 am Post subject: |
|
|
11:59
| Quote: |
| OP, I suggest you take the advice of the distracters with a pinch of salt, if not a whole shaker. A good, solid, globally-recognised pre-service course such as the CELTA, in addition to post-CELTA experience, will be a requisite to obtaining a decent (or semi-decent) TEFL post, and it does indeed make a difference as regards remuneration, as does a DELTA (which is what you should look towards a few years after completing your CELTA). |
So sorry to see your string of good posts ending.
If you want to qualify, in Hong Kong only, well, I won't say yea or nay.
Mainland China, CELTA is equal to toilet paper 99% of the time. Most schools would have no idea what a DELTA is
Kram
| Quote: |
| However, I'm still impressed with CELTA marketing and the fervour of its disciples |
Which is why a few years ago I gave up discussing CELTA vs. other certs. The "it's got to be CELTA" paranoia is as bad as the Chinese "We have 5,000 years of history"
In seven years I have never met a school that cares. A rare school wants some kind of true teaching cert/license.
But again, you can use Unle Jim Bob's Online cert as a bargaining chip to weasel out a couple extra hundred kuai |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
hermes3x
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 22
Location: TX (For Now)
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
so, effectively, all I get is opinion and conjecture and BBS historical in-fighting. Awesome. CELTA is watered down NLP. I have no expectations that the world will mirror the teaching-teachers classroom. I just want to know how charming I have to be when interviewing.
I will say, in the long run, CELTA is probably a good idea. I've got one. I'm not particularly fanatical about it, but for every one bullshit idea, they do have three good ideas. (And I am pretty resistant to crappy mind viruses.) Can't hurt to have a base and some education. I do suppose this will probably devolve into one of those training vs intuition arguments that people love to have, in any forum... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
arioch36
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 3589
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:12 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hermes
| Quote: |
| all I get is opinion and conjecture and BBS historical in-fighting |
Well let's look at your question critically
| Quote: |
| is there a noticeable pay difference for teachers with the CELTA cert versus those who come into the market with other certifications? |
You were looking for facts
What kind of facts who you be expecting??? Us to search every job, and find out exactly what is paid. Every one who works in mainland China is in total agreement. This is conjencture???I say, you were honestly and accurately answered by several posters who answered based on their experience. One person from Hong Kong, dominated by British culture, has a totally different answer. This tells you nothing? perhaps you werre not taught manners or logic. Manners after several people directly answer your wuestion to be rude to us?
And newbies to Dave's sometimes why they get no answer. You are a perfect example why.
| Quote: |
| I will say, in the long run, CELTA is probably a good idea |
Is that fact or conjecture? Based on what experience?
Manners would probably do you more good then a CELTA in the future. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kram
Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 152
Location: In a chair
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| hermes3x wrote: |
So, after having gone through the CELTA-ification process, I am now ESL hardcore, WITH NO TEACHING EXPERIENCE. How'm I lookin?
Actually, is there a noticeable pay difference for teachers with the CELTA cert versus those who come into the market with other certifications? (I'm just stalling putting together my resume and applying!) This applies to teachers with little to no prior classroom experience
H3M |
| hermes3x wrote: |
so, effectively, all I get is opinion and conjecture and BBS historical in-fighting. Awesome. CELTA is watered down NLP. I have no expectations that the world will mirror the teaching-teachers classroom. I just want to know how charming I have to be when interviewing.
I will say, in the long run, CELTA is probably a good idea. I've got one. I'm not particularly fanatical about it, but for every one bullshit idea, they do have three good ideas. (And I am pretty resistant to crappy mind viruses.) Can't hurt to have a base and some education. I do suppose this will probably devolve into one of those training vs intuition arguments that people love to have, in any forum... |
You can think what you want, mate! Four posters have told you the value of an English teaching cert, in regard to job applications, in Mainland China. As for �facts�, I suppose I could ask the FO at my uni to write a deposition and have it notarised for you.
It was mentioned previously that if you�ve a degree and a pulse, you�re well on the way to a job. I stated in a previous thread that the only benefit of having a cert is that it might be an advantage over a similar candidate who doesn�t have one.
It depends where you want to work and who you want to work for. If you fancy the BC as an IELTS examiner, then you would need a CELTA or equivalent, 3 years of experience and a BA. The requirement for Fujian province was �officially� BA + cert + experience and I've worked at other places were the requirement was a pulse. In 'my experience' universities require a degree as a minimum. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
