Job Discussion Forums

mandalayroad · Joined: 11 Mar 2008 Posts: 115

From my four years living in East Asia, I would say Korea is probably the one with the greatest xenophobic tendency, then followed by Japan. I found Taiwan to be very open to foreigners. I didn't live in China but I imagine it's more open than Japan and Korea since China has had thousands of years of experience of assimilating and accommodating foreigners in their midst. I am curious to see how the ME stacks up in comparison if I end up there.

redeyes · Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 254

deleted by redeyes

007 · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:16 pm Post subject:

Well, I think the �monoculture� society of Korea has its roots in History!

�Historically, Korea has been one of the most homogenous societies in the world, existing as a single culture and kingdom�albeit one often under the harsh control of its neighbours�from the Unified Silla period in 668 AD until 1948, when the military demarcation line was drawn at the 38th parallel, splitting it into North and South. When Hendrick Hamel, the first Westerner to write extensively about Korea, landed on Jeju-do in 1653 with his Dutch crew, he and his friends were first taken to see the king and then promptly told they could not leave, ever, presumably because the king was afraid they might bring back other idiots like themselves who couldn�t understand that sour cream and Marmite were gross�.

Also, I think, many of the native English teachers in Korea tend to lean to the right/conservative/republican/bushco side of things regarding the culture of Korea!
May be I am wrong.

redeyes · Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 254

deleted by redeyes

veiledsentiments · Joined: 20 Feb 2003 Posts: 17644 Location: USA

Interesting... most of the American TEFL teachers in the Middle East are the opposite. Lots of ex-Peace corp, mostly left to extreme left (by American standards)... mostly very anti-Bush.

Saudi may be a bit different as it draws many ex-military sort who tend more to the right.

VS

ghost · Joined: 30 Jan 2003 Posts: 1693 Location: Saudi Arabia

lmbeharry · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 6:21 pm Post subject:

Korea does tend to be at least a little bit right of center. Likewise, Korean Americans tend to right of center. In my view, Korea cloned WASP values.

In the Star Trek (The Original Series: TOS) production there is one episode directed particularly at developing Asia in the 1960's. I don't recall the name of the episode, but it revolves around a society that mimics other cultures.

The particular culture had evolved to become a gangster society (because they had found and translated an American detective novel). At the end of the episode (after Kirk, Bones, and Spock had solved the moral and ethical dilemma), Bones realizes that he forgot his Tricorder on the planet surface. Kirk (realizing that the locals will mimic and adapt the Tricorder technology and probably improve it) says, laughing, that when they come back, the locals will be demanding "a piece of the action."

The episode is pointed directly at emerging Asia. The Asian economies will demand a "piece of the action." And Korea (I think, moreso than Japan) which has adopted WASP values en masse, may owe part of its economic success through its integration of American conservative values... But moreover, since Korea is homogeneous and "hive" oriented, Koreans have averted the problems America had always faced in integrating conservative economic values across the wide spectrum of ethnic groups.

lmbeharry · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 6:35 pm Post subject:

About Right Wing Conservative Canadians and Americans.

When I taught at Ulsan University, one 60+ year old Canadian professor consistently (i.e. two or three times a week) asked me if I had Marijuana. I could not believe it. 60+ years old (former, still Hippie). I had stopped when I was 20! And I don't want to run anyone's life, but c'mon. Sixty years old????

Is that conservative??????

The local Canadian/Anglo/American hangout near Ulsan University - full of alcoholics and drug addicts...

I disagree with the above mentioned suggestion that Canadian/American expats in Korea are conservative - pro-Bush, fundamentalist types. Rather, I saw the opposite.

lmb

lmbeharry · Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject:

By the way. I am conservative (just a little right of center) but NOT PRO-BUSH!

BUSH's actions have cost the U.S. a great loss of credibility worldwide.

And Iraq will be the most costly fiasco in American history. There is absolutely no economic or financial gain to be had - especially considering that U.S. already had air bases in Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and Kuwait, not to mention the fleet in the Persian Gulf.

Since WWII, the U.S. has been the occupying force in Japan and Germany. Now, the U.S. will have to foot the bill for occupation in Iraq.

I'm conservative. Bush, well, he's my president, but I do not approve of the actions of his administration.

lmb

mandalayroad · Joined: 11 Mar 2008 Posts: 115

I doubt there would be many right wing Americans among Middle East Tefl-ers since most of them would be scared to go due to Islamophobia.

I found Korea interesting and fun as a trip but I could not imagine living there to teach for a number of reasons. And the thought of most of the Americans being right wing bible thumpers is just more of a turn off along with all the fundamentalist Korean Christians. I imagine there is a lot more US right wing fans in Korea than other locales since there is so much recruitment of TEFL teachers for Korea on Craig's List, Monster and other easy to access job searches. It's currently the path of least resistance to getting an overseas TEFL job with a decent salary.

I'm in the US currently but plan to go back abroad this summer, hopefully to the ME as I have a good lead in the UAE. Otherwise, I'll head back to SE Asia for the long term. I will not go someplace cold, as a native New Yorker I've had enough of that.... brrr... Wink

Stephen Jones · Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Posts: 4124

There are a fair number of rednecks in Saudi, though the majority of long-term American teachers I have met have been, as VS says, moderately liberal in their views.

I had a colleague who for some years was responsible for the EFL training in a Jubail factory. The staff consisted of himself and nine other Americans, four rednecks and five raging queens. In deference to VS's notorious pathological prudery I won't repeat any of the staffroom conversations. The Saudi manager liked the job so much he took early retirement.

veiledsentiments · Joined: 20 Feb 2003 Posts: 17644 Location: USA

pat blake · Joined: 21 Nov 2006 Posts: 31 Location: Kuwait

I live without a car in Kuwait. It is do-able. You can't be as spontaneous, but if you really don't want to drive, there are plenty of taxis (too many now!) and sometimes private drivers availaable.

scot47 · Joined: 10 Jan 2003 Posts: 15343

Alkies who come to Saudi get alkier. Or get sober. They sure don't stay in the same place.

sliderama · Joined: 11 Nov 2007 Posts: 90 Location: al reef

wow, this topic is a hotbed of activity! away for a week and outta da loop...

redeyes- do i agree Korea is the most inward looking? yes and no, korea is very self-obsessed with its own culture, but then where isn't. I think it has developed that way due to in part to the japanese occupation, something that still defines modern (south & maybe even north) korea, i mean how many museums are there in the country devoted to that part of history? and personally i can understand that, having lived in japan and korea. as well as china, but i find it odd how all three countries absolutely detest each other! but japan is also as a monocultural as korea and in fact shares so many similarities with korea that it is quite ironic due to the hatred between these two nations. but there are of course many many differences as well. it's odd how many of my students admire japanese economic success but will parrot the propaganda drilled into them since childhood about korean culture etc.

about teachers being right wing, i find korea attracts a bit of the bottom of the barrel in teachers (for asia anyways). its the only country i've been in where canadians have a BAD rep, which i agree with, due to the fact that recruiters grab many of the recent grads and lure them to korea and these grads are often from redneck ontario (even tho the most populous area of canada) and have little travel and cultural experience.

ghost- are you really in South Korea? to deny the influence of Confucianism here one must be blind, just look at the language of honorifics here. you must address your senior with a higher amount of respect and use a different title. have you not been out drinking with koreans? my korean kitesurf buddies won't let me pour my own soju or give them respect by touching my sleeve, cuz i'm older (by a decade). they say it's nice that i try to treat them with (equal) respect but that it's not respecting their culture, so I should treat them as lower as they do with each other, depending on their age. so your statement that Confucianism is non-existant here flies completely in the fact of my personal (and many friend's of mine) experiences. I've found Korea to be more Confucian than China, where it was born and developed, but that could be due to the influence of Mao and communism, tho I've read it is re-emerging there due to a relative relaxing of the grip on society by the CP.

And ghost you say you have trouble placing recruits who are over 40? The avereage age where i work is probably about 40, we have one 73 y.o. and the pub where i have the odd drink has many uni teachers over 40 as well. so i'm mystified by some of your statements...

all of these comments made in the spirit of debate Very Happy