Job Discussion Forums

[Jetgirly]

I submitted my second-term marks today and some students did fail, though not as many as in the first semester. Some of my students have told me that they WANT to fail, because then they get to go to "remedials" for an hour a day after school for one week... and "EVERYBODY gets 100% at remedials!" Thus, things like sending the students away to do the work on their own time isn't effective, as for about 30% of them failing is a good option. The whole system in the school is flawed and encourages bad behavior, and I think that in a lot of ways my issues are more with the school than the students. They're just responding to the situation they're in. That being said, I would like to see some of the respect I give the students returned to me.

As for my Canadian university, I honestly don't think anyone cares about us. Nobody from the department has ever checked in with us to see how things are going. We had to contact the university a few times to clarify the terms of the agreement, as we have no written contract with anyone outlining our rights and responsibilities, and responses were always very pro-prepa. The woman who ran the program last year quit, and the woman who ran the program this year (my year) got fired and hasn't been replaced, so we're kind of in limbo. I am definitely going to let the univeristy know that the placement is horrible (and I've also reached out on Facebook to students considering coming next year if the program is still offered), but with the frequent staff turnovers who knows if next year's coordinator will get the information? As well, there are connections between my university and the Mexican university on several levels, and I think the university may be willing to sacrifice two student teachers each year if it saves other programs. We were contacted by a professor who has never taught either of us, and he just wanted to check how things were going. He told us a group of profs have been lobbying for five years to have this placement cancelled, but the department won't hear of it. There must be more to it than just us two student teachers frolicking around a Mexican prepa teaching English to joyful, wonderful students with the full support of admin and their coworkers...

[leslie]

Bye

[Prof.Gringo]

[MO39]

Prof. gringo,

Speak for yourself, buster! I think that jetgirly has every right in the world to post her teaching tales of horror - just because you don't give a damn about the sufferings of a fellow (and novice, keep that in mind, too) teacher doesn't mean that the rest of us feel the same way. If you don't want to read what she has to say, then don't! He dicho....!!

MO

[Prof.Gringo]

[M@tt]

can you kick people out of class? i would try to identify the few students who are actually interested in learning and teach to them. ignore the rest. this might actually motivate some of the bad ones to pay more attention.
i did this for a few days when i taught uni students. they practically self-segregated themselves anyway. all the good students sat in the front left section, so i started looking and talking directly to them and essentially ignoring the other 2/3 of the class. (this was after lots of discipline issues like coming to class high, throwing things, punching people, etc). it didn't really change people much but it allowed me to get some real teaching done with the small group who actually cared. at some point i had to just quit thinking about the rest of them. again, this works much better if you can also kick people out. you may end up with 3 students but it's better than 30 monkeys.

i can also see prof. gringo's point although i never got there myself. if i were still teaching private students in mexico i might feel that way. it's not a point you want to reach in the first couple years of teaching though. i would guess that for many people, the type of attitude he has adopted would be the only thing allowing them to continue teaching in mexico year after year. it kind of depends on the type of teacher you are and the type of person you are, and of course on the type of students you have. anyway, just try to identify the good students and do your best for them. some of the bad ones will shape up for you and the rest are not your problem.

[Samantha]

Prof gringo wrote:

[Oreen Scott]

I think Professor Gringo is in survival mode. That's where I'm at in my current position. Throughout any given day I say, "I don't care, and I really mean I don't care."

However, I'm in survival mode, I'm there for the pay cheque and I'm on my way out, and I make no bones about it. That doesn't necessarily make me a bad employee but it certainly doesn't make me a dedicated employee.

I'm entering the teaching field. Over the past three years I've spent a great deal of time, money and energy learning to teach. I won't allow my "I don't care" attitude into my work as a teacher. I'd quit first. Working only for money is not, for me, or a lot of other people, very safisfying.

Professor Gringo, we are all different. You might consider being a little more understanding of those on the forum who care.

[Oreen Scott]

Samantha, the rooster is cute but I don't know the point. I'm curious, please, what is the rooster saying, or doing. Running away?

[Prof.Gringo]

[Prof.Gringo]

MO39, I don't consider the OP to be a "novice", even if she is new to ESL in Mexico, because of her extensive qualifications. It's interesting to note that even though she is so well qualified she continues to have major problems. I believe the OP misses the point that this is Mexico and students, especially the fresa private-prepa ones are all too often like the ones at her school. None of us is ever going to change their attitude, behavior or discipline overnight or without the support of the parents, admin. and the other teachers. It's sadly the way things are at many of the private schools.

I choose to stay and make the best of it. I hope that my students learn something from each class and that I can impart some knowledge to them. The education system in Mexico is a bit different from other countries. The expectations here lean more towards memorizing and passing tests than teaching students how to think logically. If I ask a typical class a question I'm lucky to get five responses out of 25 students. Even then, the students can't seem to tell me why they think like that or explain what they believe. They just do, so it's right. Typical fresa student statement " AMLO is an idiot" Me "OK, tell why he's an idiot?" student "He just is." Me "But can you tell me some reasons and provide an example why?" Student "My dad says he's an idiot so he is" And that's how it goes.

These students often times grow up in an environment where they don't learn any responsibility or respect. They have servants that do all of the housework and often take care of all their needs. Many of these kids think that because their parents pay for them to be at a school the teachers are an extension of this and are essentially their to serve the students and make sure they pass. It's a disgusting attitude to see in them, but it's true that many of them believe this way. I've heard students say that as well as they are so rich they don't need to study. Try to motivate them and it's like talking to a (gold) brick wall. We have called their parents in and they blame the teachers for most, if not all of the students problems and behavior. I'm just an English teacher. Nothing more, nothing less. I can't be expected to be the one to instill in these kids a sense of values and responsibilities if their parents do nothing.

As my rant continues...I don't have the same amount of training and education as an English teacher as some others do (the OP), yet I believe that I do a decent job in my classes. I still teach my students, they are learning something and I don't take too much disrespect from them. There are absolute limits in my classes, cross the line and leave my class. I also don't take it home at the end of the day, it's just a job. I do the best can with a difficult situation.

BTW Samantha, I like the rooster and I don't mind if I do, cock-a-doodle-do!

[Phil_K]

It's interesting sometimes assessing the character of some of the posters on this forum!

Of course, there are some out-and-out BSers, there always are, but I think the Prof. writes very eloquently at times and makes sense, maybe he doesn't always make his point in the most diplomatic way - just human, as I am. I used to think the same about Samantha, but I have grown to respect her contribution, based on a lot of experience. I think we should read the posts with an open mind, reject what we think is BS, but not resort and childish namecalling - something that Mr.K will pick up on quick enough anyway.

[mapache]

One more observation: The culture of the Mexican upper middle class and the neuvo rich treats teaches like any other worker - peon, muchacha de casa (kind of like Americans treat their illegal Mexicans maids and gardeners)

The children learn this behavior from the parents. The teacher is just another worker who does not have to be respected. Two of my 7 year old rich kid students try to push my hands away from my computer so they can control it. I tell them "es muy rudo" but these words don't seem to phase them as they scream at and order around their muchacha de casa as well.
This behavior is learned early, condoned by parents and continues in adolescence.

[MO39]

[mapache]

MO39 - gracias, disculpe mi mal espanol