Job Discussion Forums

[Bradfrd12]

I will preface this topic with a little disclaimer:

I am not a dodgy-teacher hating-scamming-selfish- loop hole finding-screw everyone this is business-kind of director. I am an honest hard working entrepreneur trying to raise a family in a difficult sector. I have experience both on the teaching and directing end so I know a dodgy dead-beat boss when I see one. I also know the brutal reality of what happens behind the scenes at a language academy.

With that said I shall begin. I do expect to have to defend everything I write here and hope that none of you think I am pure bourgeoisie just trying to crap on the worker.

I personally think that several factors have lead to a rampant increase in teachers' wages in Valencia. I can only speak of Valencia because that is where I have been living and working for the past 7 years. Of course as a teacher you never see it like this but as a director it is all too clear. The market average wage here in Valencia is around 11� -12�/hour for first year teachers.

If we are actually talking about TEACHERS then I agree that this wage is good or even a little low. If someone comes to me with a good CV including but not limited to teaching qualifications, certificates in ESL, experience, skills in IT, accounting, marketing etc... then I am more than willing to negotiate salary. I mean these are professional people trying to earn a living after all. This is on par with marketers, ad agents, bankers, and other educated middle class professional jobs.

What gets me are the hundreds of gap year backpackers that think a jaunt across the continent can easily be funded by teaching English. Just being native is not a qualification for being an English teacher and I resent anyone who says that my years of study and hardwork are for nothing. So when someone comes to my school with no qualifications and no experience looking for work I tell them that I will train them and they can learn to be a teacher but their wage will be 7�/hour which is on par with jobs that don't require experience or qualifications to enter like barmen, supermarket clerks etc....all of these positions (maybe not in Spain as much per se) have potential for growth within the company which with experience and training brings higher wages.

I am not going to continue. Bottom line is that I have decided that only experienced qualified people will help me build my business to the best it can be and they will earn the wage they deserve. I pay full contracts, I pay good wage and I expect the teachers to earn it as I have and do.

I am sure this is going to leave a bad taste in some people's mouths but I can take it.

[Phil_b]

Some interesting points here...

I have no idea what the market is like in Valencia - I'm an experienced and qualified teacher and I wouldn't go near a job paying �12.50 an hour - but then I'm not in Valencia... and you were talking about people just off a CELTA course...

I'd be interested to know if schools which employ better qualified and more experienced teachers are actually more successful as businesses - or if people are just looking for the cheapest classes, or a nice guiri for a teacher...

Of course what I'm really interested in is how a teacher with decent experience and qualifications can earn a decent living - not just support themselves on an extended holiday....

[Bradfrd12]

well phil.....good questions.

I understand what you mean about not going near 12.50 I wouldn't either but here's the difference. I am not a teacher. I am a self-employed teacher/director of an academy. This is the difference. When I go to a class to teach I don't go for less than 30�/hour but if I want the same margin and send in a teach then I am charging at least 42.50/hour and now you are skating on thin ice because there is a very good chance you don't get the contract for that price because there is someone willing to do it for 30�. This is the problem.

I hope that academies which employ experienced people do better because that's my business model. If not I'll let you know as soon as I go bankupt.

Making a living and not just supporting yourself is very difficult. Maybe working your way up to DoS or something along those lines would provide that but as for just teaching I think that the ceiling is very low indeed.

[gracias]

An interesting thread. I hope it keeps going cos it has great potential.

I try not to get out of bed for less than EU30 an hour either, but if you are business-minded there are occasions when you do.

The real problem is that there will always be someone to undercut you, and though they will maybe not provide the high-level service that you will, price-per-hour is the BIGGEST factor of all.

I would love to say I make EU30 an hour, every hour, but I don't. You have to take chances and sometimes they pay off, sometimes they don't.

As for the unqualified, EU7 an hour seems more than fair.

[workingnomad]

Euro 30 an hour! Thats pretty good, is that freelancing or do you own a business and you hire out teachers for that?

[Bradfrd12]

Generally that's freelance. There's no way you will get 30� / hour working for an academy, at least when speaking about Valencia. Unless they have some pucker gov't contracts (which do exist).

If you are a teacher working for an academy then a very good salary, either from putting years in with the same school or a sh*t load of qualifications and experience to back you up, would be 15� / hour. That's about the ceiling. Any higher than that and the academy will fail to hit any sort of decent margin and eventually fold.

On the flip side of the coin, as I previously mentioned in another post, I firmly believe that virtually minimum wage is fair for inexperienced and unqualified workers in any sector, private ESL included.