Job Discussion Forums

[Roger]

Standardisation is the norm in all countries with a mother tongue in the name of that country: Italians have Tuscanny dialect as the norm; Germans use I don't know which one (in Luther's days it was an Eastern German dialect), and the French accept nobody but their Academie francaise's regulating voice on this sensitive subject; China has Peking dialect as the overriding lingua franca but most people, when watching TV, rely on subtitles in the programme to follow it.


With the English language, it's a lot more difficult for practical and political reasons.
I do think it's a disservice to our students to be exposed to various rather dissimilar Englishes although it can also be viewed as an advantage. IT's a disadvantage during the "formative" years of an English in 'construction" (laying the foundation); there is nothing uglier than a foreign English sprinkled with Texan twang, Aussie bits and a British intonation.
I agree with Capergirl in saying Hollywood English never fails to be understood; can t be one of the standard accents?

I am sure that the sometimes unfriendly disconcordance etween Brits and Americans will lead to non-native speakers of English taking the initative.
I can imagine Europeans setting standards as English is ever more widely used at universities in the E.U. attracting overseas students.
And IELTS is fast replacing the TOEFL anyway.

[shmooj]

[khmerhit]

Hey shmooj, did you marry into the aristocracy, realize your mistake and flee abroad? Lighten up , old man-- you'll give yourself a rotten crick in the neck!

[leeroy]

I can't bear it any longer

[Roger]

One of the hitherto overlooked problems is that native English teachers regard their own lingo as s t a n d a r d to the exclusion of their local teachers' accent.
Surely a standard pronunciation and intonation, not to mention syntax and grammar, are absolutely called for in an internati9o0nal setting such as the one in which any of us finds himself or herself??

"Facilitator", "partner" and what like - sorry, that sounds too PC to me. This is the kind of "professional" slang that ESL/EFL types use to defend their presence in a foreign country, practising conversational English.
At this stage, with our learners having been exposed to their own local teachers' English for many years, and perhaps having listened (or not) to x tapes, VCD's etc., what "accent" do they have? Do they understand any native speaker, whether speaker of standard English or a more regional variety???
The real snobbism comes from TEFLers in foreign countries who portray English as the language where anything goes. That's why we have a Chinglish, a Japlish, a Koringlish, besides many other mutually unintelligible gibberishes!

[M.]

Sternnacious. the master Linguist. I find your arguements quite amusing to say the least. The EMERGENCY situation you seem to imply sounds somewhat warped to justify your view. As far as dialects go, I have found in my teaching experiences(Japan, Russia, Germany).....Most students can not even idetify different accents until they are at Intermediate level or in most cases well above. And as far as setting a standard....I find that fairly sad coming from a self-proclaimed linguist. Linguistics usuallly strives to show the richness in diversity of languages, dialects and accents. Your stadard schtick sounds like an advert from McDonalds or Unilever. Go work for them if you want standards and Formika Tables.

M....

[shmooj]

[James Stunell]

Well, I think this thread has come to a natural end, as the same old arguments come trotting out on both sides. And, yes, Shmooj, I think that we must be very, very different. But thank you for taking the trouble to reply. It's been fun and I look forward to locking horns with you again on a different topic in the future.
Yours till the next thread of interest,
James

[Capergirl]

[Lanza-Armonia]

Call me indifferent an'all but I think if you wanna learn Eng-ger-leesh why not learn the original one? The British accent is understood and loved the world over so why not teach their ponouciation and grammer.

On the other hand the Northern-American English is more widely used than any other English. It seams there are arguements both ways so I am going to start a new thread...see ya there...

[Will.]

Good or bad accent, who decides? Who has the right to say that your native tongue is not good. People who pay you to do something for them.
You want to get on, you adapt. You don't like it, move on. Sue.
Some people are more able to adapt than others. Their accent changes as they progress. Some don't, so what.
If all the women in the world looked exactly the same are you telling me all the men would be happy? And vice versa for the ladies....
Variety is the spice of life and i personally enjoy teaching and demonstrating different accents to students. They also find it interesting.
And anyway I have tried the 'merrcun' accent, I found it sadly lacking in variety and flexibility of vocalisation and just plain ugly at times. This is not to flame, there are some accents 'over there' I find attractive, sensual and even warm.
Lets all adopt Australian accents, vocabulary and select a dialect to tell our employers is now the new Standard English. I am sure this will work.................NOT
It ain't gonna change, not overnight and not in our lifetimes, if it does we will still complain.