Job Discussion Forums

[herzog]

Hello all!
I'm an absolute newbie and just going through the Newbie Forum overwhelms me with its volume -- and that's just one forum! So, instead of spending two hours more looking for my topic, I'll just post it. Sorry, but my question has been asked before.
I know all about the onsites TEFL certification courses, and I notice that online courses are indeed a lot cheaper. These days, meaning as of this year, what's the scoop on employer attitude towards these? I've read in one of the postings that it actually depends on the region. The ones I'm looking at are the following: Indonesia (either Java or Bali), Malaysia (but not Singapor), the island of Borneo (especially Brunei).
I've seen many job offers for these destinations, and most are all absolutely clear in their demand for a Bachelors and a recognized certification. Ok. But what about having a Cert that was evidently obtained online?
I can imagine what it's worth (since there's no teaching practicum)...however, I have some experience teaching esl, though it isn't much. For one year I was an esl tutor for foreign students, college level in Upstate NY. I did an additional year of the same at City College. All my tutees were foreign students. Some time later, I spent about six months at a private school in South India as a volunteer. No pay but free room&board. A little later, I found myself in Thailand and got a temp job at a large private school just outside Bangkok. here again, it was just a replacement contract(5 months, then the visa policies changed, no more indefinite renewals!)--. In both instances for Asia, I was never alone with the kids, but always the assistant of an experienced local teacher.
I'm not telling all of this to lay out my resume (though it kind of does...), but I just want to give a better idea about the little experience I've had thus far. I'm only wondering if an online Tesol is of any use on my CV, as far as schools in Indonesia and Malaysia are concerned. I'm visiting both countries this winter to have a look around, and I'm definitely looking for schools. Otherwise my professional experience has always been C++ programming This is how I can afford to travel, but there are limits here: an onsite Tefl cert is quite an investment. Sure, I'd take one in Bali for a month. Sounds nice....but pricey, and of what use locally? Ok, I'd better stop. Any info of this, and the current evolution of the esl market in Malaysia and Indonesia is greatly appreciated. I'm aware of the Indonesia forum and shall go there forthwith.
Cheers Herzog

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

Assuming that you have a degree to go along with that potential online certificate that you're asking about:

They speak English as the language of business in Malaysia. No online short certificate will impress them (I would guess that a recognized university certificate like from Birmingham would be okay, though- but that's a really a lot more work than a CELTA). 'Recognized' certificates do not usually include online ones. They usually mean at MINIMUM a CELTA. I guess some places may accept something a little shorter if it was done in person. I think they're looking for people with more professional level qualifications (as in University qualifications, or CELTA [and?] DELTA [combos]) in places like Malaysia).

Don't know about Indonesia or Borneo, though.

Just a question: Why don't you go back to Thailand, get a job there, and do a CELTA? Or got to Korea or somewhere for a few years and save the money to do a university qualification, then once you've got the money to be able to do it and enough to get you through the year (if you have a part time job to make ends meet) do that? Or else do a distance degree while teaching in Korea or wherever. Then, once you've paid it all off, you can go to Malaysia. Of course, that's basically a career move, not just something to do for a couple of years. So if you are thinking of only a couple of years, why not go to Japan, Korea, or Taiwan, then use vacation time to travel to Malaysia? Or save as much now as you can now, skipping the online certificate, go to Thailand, get another better job in Thailand then the one you had, use the pay from that for day to day living, and use the savings that you bring with you to travel to Malaysia?

[Def]

Hey,

Not quite sure about specifics relating to the countries you mentioned, but I've spent a good deal of time reading through these forums (as I'm sure many others have), and from that alone I can tell you now that most of what you'll read on this issue states online cert's are useless.

Or at the very best, close to useless.

Of course, keep reading through the posts at your leisure, but that will be the general feeling coming through.

[naturegirl321]

ONline certs, unless they include 120 hours plus hands on teaching, aren't worth much.

[Justin Trullinger]

Do a search of this forum and others, and you'll see a lot on this subject. The short version is: Online certs mostly aren't real qualifications- just a way to separate a fool from his or her money. Good employers know it. Bad employers would hire you with nothin.

Not worth it. Just my opinion, but I do hire teachers.


Justin

[celtica]

Brunei requires teacher training , TESL/TEFL . Check out www.cfbt.org.bn.

Qualified teachers are paid well, provided housing, flights home, bonuses etc ..... it can be demanding work (though shorter hours than western hours)

You would be very welcome with teaching qualifications especially if with computer knowhow......big move to put ICT into all schools at present.

[herzog]

Thank you, everybody. I'll keep scouring these forums for more data. I do learn quite a lot just visiting this cafe. Indeed, when something sounds too good to be true, it usually is. I've narrowed my sights on Bali or Brunei, actually, and I'm checking out this EF business, since I hear an awful lot about them.
It's good to hear that Brunei is making a big IT move for their school. That's right up my alley.
Cheers,
H

[naturegirl321]

[Justin Trullinger]

[Chancellor]

[Def]

[Serious_Fun]

[herzog]

Ok, I know I looked at this the wrong way. It's just that the fees for those certfication courses are a real turn-off. In any case, I'm now looking only for Indonesia, especially east Java or Bali. I have some questions regarding this region, but I will post them on the Ind forum. I may go in Oct. and stay a while. It's obvious the ideal is to do an onsite Cert course, in the nation where you want to work.
Cheers all,
Herzog

[herzog]

[quote="Justin Trullinger"]

[Justin Trullinger]

I was actually quoting naturegirl when I wrote that, as I DON't consider it an advantage to be the DOS in two years....


But DOS is short for Director of Studies...


Slds,
Justin