Job Discussion Forums

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

When to fight and when to walk away...I don't know. I was at a school, the students wanted me to stay, the coteachers wanted me to stay, the other workers and neighbors wanted me to stay.

I heard that they found they could higher a teacher for a 1,000 RMB less. I still often visit the school, I put a lot into the school, butit is still abummer. And now, of course, they can't admit they made a mistake hiring a different teacher.

Good luck

Lynn · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 696 Location: in between

Wow. What an overwhelming response. Thanks everyone!

I decided to move on. My plan was to stay here in NY alone for 3-4 months while my husband awaits his greencard in Japan. But now, I plan to just move back west and stay with my mom for a few months. Being jobless and partnerless in NY is something I can't deal with right now.

As for taking the boss to the cleaners, I don't think it's worth it. I don't think he did anything illegal. It was a part-time job w/o benefits and the pay was the lowest I have ever seen for an ESL teacher, $12 an hour. No prep time, no copy machine, no nothing. I think I'll just have my paycheck mailed to me. I know myself, and if I walked through those doors again, I know I would break down and start crying. I refuse to play the sympathy card.

Maybe it was a blessing in disguise.

As for taking it personally...I know I have. I think some of you made a good point about the sub being the new flavor of the month, and nothing more. I knew from the beginning that the boss didn't know a thing about teaching.

I just want to say thanks again. I was very apprenhensive about posting this and almost deleted it, but I'm glad I didn't. No one really understands like other ESL teachers who have been in the same position.

lagerlout2006 · Joined: 17 Sep 2003 Posts: 985

Lynn May I offer the first negative comments???

Before I do let me say I agree that this is beyond the pale. To return from a holiday and find out your substitute has been given your job??? That is too much. I just returned from a holiday and after having spent a lot of my extra money this would have been bad news indeed. Did you have no contract protection??

Now to the negativity. Should not alarm bells have gone off when Donna was fired?? She was you say a fine teacher but the school gave you her classes because of student complaints.. Or because you were more popular or considered prettier. She was your friend but you kept the job. You should have known the school were ---philistines---and could not be trusted as far as they could be thrown. What goes around comes around and you should not have been surprised.

Laura C · Joined: 14 Oct 2003 Posts: 211 Location: Saitama

Take a bow and a red face lagerlout. Embarassed

Lynn did leave that job a few weeks later.

Now please don't start combing my posts looking for inconsistencies, cos you'll be there all day... Very Happy

L

markoinbangkok · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 27

johnslat · Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2004 11:13 pm Post subject: This is how you should feel

Dear markoinbankok,
Well, good luck telling people how they should feel (i.e. "take something"). Personally, I've never found it a very productive action since most of us have little or no control over how we react to bad news. Moreover, I think most of us would, in like circumstances, "take it personally", irregardless of whether it should have been so taken or not.
You certainly have the right to express your opinion on the matter, but I'd say the manner of your doing so showed a certain amount of insensitivity with respect to the OP's - guess what - feelings.
Regards,
John

markoinbangkok · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 27

Hi John...

You have totally misread the post. I am sure that when you re-read this thread you will feel more than a bit silly!

johnslat · Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:02 am Post subject: The school of tough love

Dear markoinbangkok,
OK, there's always the possibility (howsoever faint) that I'm simply being thick because I just can't see "my first error" - hmm, didn't see a second one mentioned, though:

"Do you see your first error? Well, let me explain it to you. I wasn't telling Lynn how she should feel at all. I was suggesting that she had maybe over-reacted and taken the whole business too personally. (That assumption later proved to be correct, after Lynns subsequent post.) "

So, telling Lynn that she'd taken the whole business too personally was NOT telling her how she should feel? I don't see how it's not. Just what WAS it doing then? When a person "takes something too personally", doesn't that refer to how they feel about something? If, for example, you fire me, would I be wrong in thinking that this action was directed against me personally and that I must have failed in some way to do my job to your satisfaction. That could possibly NOT be the actual case, of course, but considering the explanation the OP was given for her dismissal:

" Well, I got a call from my boss telling me that I don't have to come back to work tomorrow because the students want to stick with the substitute for a few more weeks. "

it's hard for me to see how anyone could NOT take it as a personal reflection on how they were performing.

As for the matter of your "insensitivity"

" Yes... I have been accused of this before."

Well, I suppose that's a matter of individual interpretation. You seem to take pride in being more of a "cold water in the face" kind of guy. I'm not so sure that's always the right approach, but I suppose we're all stuck with our own outlooks and styles. I like my eggs hard-boiled, but when it comes to people, I figure that since life ain't fair or kind, that's all the more reason we should always try to be with each other.
Regards,
John

markoinbangkok · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 27

Good luck, John. Thanks for your response. I wish you well.

Marko

johnslat · Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:17 am Post subject: I do mountains

Dear markoinbankok,
Likewise to you - wish you well, marko. I suspect I'm making a rather large mountain out of a very small molehill here.
Regards,
John

markoinbangkok · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 27

It ain't you, John. I just manage to find a way to piss folk off! Very Happy

Anyway, the point is that Lynn doesn't regret posting here and has been generally pleased with what she has had back in the way of responses!

She'll probably not sleep at night now though, thinking that you and I are gonna be at it hammer and tongs till breakfast!

Cheers,

Marko

johnslat · Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:42 am Post subject: If I had a hammer

Dear markoinbangkok,
We've got to stop meeting like this. You're dead right about the main point, but no hammer and tongs. I beat mine into a plowshare years ago.
Now if I only had a field to plant something in.
Regards,
John

Roger · Joined: 19 Jan 2003 Posts: 9138

I have been in this country the longest, or at least I am one of those who have been here the longest, so evidently I can tell a few stories.
At first I hesitated, but the outpourings of others confirmed my intimate conviction that unfairness is rampant.

First tale:
My private tutorial centre boss renewed my contract after my first year there; then he decided to task me with helping his wife run a new training centre in his native Shandong province. I had a girlfriend, lived in a well-appointed flat (rented by my employer) and had a visa valid for Guangdong; I agreed to work for his wife for a short period of time out of my own curikosity about Shandong.
That was a mistake. Within 5 weeks, my livelihood started unraveling.
The police waylaid me, walked me home in that Shandong town, inspected my passport, then put me under virtual house arrest in a hotel, until my boss arrived to buy my freedom.
My boss was on a business trip to Moscow, so it took some time before he arrived in Shandong. I was lucky the PSB had lent me an ear and some credibility; my boss was fined for employing me in the wrong locale, and housing me without having reported me to the PSB in the first place...
I returned to Guangdong, and was fired - with another 9 months to go on my new visa.

Second unfair dismissal:
Actually a non-renewal of a contract. It was in this normal school where I had hit it off extremely well.
Too well with some students.
Some girls asked me to be allowed to install their computer in my school flat. A Chinese colleague encouraged me in doing this, saying he too was receiving students in his home all the time.
I spent many nights away from the school, so I gave the girls my key. Everything was fine for some time, until I was surprised to be billed somewhere around RMB 100 in telephone charges, way over the top, it seemed to me! I told the girls not to make phone calls from my telephone - they promised, but the next month the bill was even steeper, somewhere close to RMB 150.
I remonstated with the girls. New promises. Next bill cost me several hundred yuan, and by then I was furious.
The last bill was so high I didn't pay until I secured the girls' consent to refunding me the amount.
But this took some time to obtain from them. They even blackmailed me by saying their boyfriends were cops who would look after them...
Finally the school got involved in this nasty business, I got my refund from the girls, but the principal did clearly not want to see a repeat of those scenes.
Although the girls were not from any of my classes, theymanaged to inflict a lasting damage to my reputation. My colleagues and my own classes were in favour of retaining me; my name was sullied though!

Lynn · Joined: 28 Jan 2003 Posts: 696 Location: in between

If anyone is still reading this thread, I just wanted to update.

Life is good, again!

I actually work at a few different schools, other than the one where I got fired. I had to tell the 3 other schools this week what had happened. The first school I told was so supportive. The principal couldn't believe how unethical that other school was, and gave me a reference to a school in the Seattle area where he used to be the principal.

The second school offered to make up the hours that I had lost, and even increase the pay to $20!!!

At the third school, I had a long talk with the manager about life, marriage, greencards, and future. It was so nice. I saw an old student in the hall to a class I had 2 years ago. We almost cried when we saw each other. It brought back so many wonderful memories.

I decided to go back to Banana school (where Donna get let go). I was so surpised to see my old colleuges. They all hugged and kissed me and we got caught up. (of course, management ignored me).

I feel so good. I'm getting closure and leaving on an excellent note. Everyone is happy for me and my decsion to move on. When I think about it, I really didn't want to live in New York apart from my husband, anyhow.

Getting fired was the best thing that happened to me. I always wanted to leave that school because of the low pay and poor work conditions. And the students that were really close to my heart had already left last Christmas. I called them the "Fab 5" and I still keep in touch with one through email.

I've been emotional and negative lately, but I've turned over a new leaf and I'm ready to take on the world!