Job Discussion Forums

[enoch83]

I'm currently in Taiwan contemplating a short stint in mongolia in early '09. From what i've read on here, i've gathered that it can be a hellish place to work i.e. Santis/Hartford, etc but i really want to go experience the wild west. Heeding others' experiences, i dont think I could stomach a full year there, but i'd like to try 6 months. I know i could just travel through there but i really like to "get in" a place. I read that some time in Jan/Feb is the midterm and many teachers up and leave so i was wondering if i could just find a job until the end of the 2nd term in june/july. would be a good idea to go then? any constructive advice would be much appreciated

[renzobenzo1]

i saw a job advertised for santis "the most prestigious language school" supposedly but you say it is hellish...how come?

[enoch83]

Well i dunno if you've done much reading on these boards but if you do, you'll know why.

[traveler106]

But I also don't work for Santis or Hartford. I've heard a lot of bad things about both of those schools, mainly Santis. Well, as far as Santis goes, what would you expect from a school that will hire pretty much anybody over the Internet?

I like the school where I teach.

The main issue as I see it, though, is your reason for coming here. It seems to me like you would be better off working in Taiwan until summer, so you can save up your money, then coming here for a vacation. Working in Ulaanbaatar is not going to give you an "experience of the wild west." It's a dirty, run-down, Soviet-built city of about 1 million. Not exactly the pictures you see in the travel guides.

Furthermore, the experiences backpackers have and rave about here is a very sheltered view of what Mongolia is really like.

If you want to "experience the wild west," come here for a vacation. If you want to learn about what Mongolia is really like, then come here to work.

[Hoodoo Guru]

Actually, schools and training centres can offer very different conditions.

My advice would be : "Don't trust flashy websites showing new buildings and nice facilities."
It is very important to stay here for a while and see for yourself.

It all depends on how much you can take and how long you are here for.


ESP was a decent place until recently.

I don't know what Orchlon is like these days, but it used to be a horrendous place full of rich and lazy spoiled hip hop brats with absolutely incoherent management.

Talk Talk can be good for some teachers and some students - they use the so-called "Callan method"- but it's definitely not my cup of tea.I hear they pay $ 1500.

Santis has become Inlingua with the same people in charge, so, don't bother!'nuff said!

The Russian School apparently treats its foreign teachers well.

The American School of Ulaanbaatar does pay well but they only spend money on visible things whereas some classes don't even have textbooks.
They do have two swimming pools ...desperately empty.
Management also seems to be rubbish.

Hobby School is not an upmarket school but it does offer students good value for money - or it did, if things have changed.Their students and the ones from the Russian School regularly win the English Olympiads.I don't know how much they pay their teachers, though.

The International School of Ulaanbaatar, the Elite School, Orchlon and the American School of Ulaanbaatar are possibly the most expensive ones but whether they treat their teachers well remains to be seen.Big turnover, I've been told.

What usually makes a big difference - I know it's a common place - is management.
In schools and training centres where it's all about the money and not the people or not about teaching, it doesn't take long to find out.
A lot of unscrupulous "managers" charge students big money, hire unqualified teachers , pay them peanuts and pocket the cash.

And, do not forget that Ulaanbaatar is NOT Mongolia, but only its capital.
Living in Ulaanbaatar is much more difficult and expensive for Mongolians than it would be at the countryside,though.
That is why you have a certain amount of people ready to take advantage of you in Ulaanbaatar.

There are huge discrepancies between schools in Ulaanbaatar but also between the capital and the countryside schools.
To quote a foreign colleague of mine who took part in a seminar, :"In Ulaanbaatar, your problem is:'What textbooks am I going to use this year?',whereas ours is "How can we get textbooks in time at the countryside?"

I can't afford to be a volunteer now, but I am considering teaching at the countryside in a few years.
It could be an unforgettable experience for people who are ready and willing.

[Travel Zen]

How are the students ?

[traveler106]

"Talk Talk can be good for some teachers and some students - they use the so-called "Callan method"- but it's definitely not my cup of tea.I hear they pay $ 1500."

I work for Talk Talk, and I've worked there almost since the school started.

First of all, the proper term is "Callan Method." Not "so-called 'Callan Method.'" But that's not my point.

We used to use the old books written by Robin Callan, and they were, admittedly, a drag. The first few books were OK, but then it gets weird and dull.

Now we have a completely new set of books produced by the school (which recently opened another branch in Hanoi, Vietnam). The new books use the same question/answer technique as the Callan books, but they include student interaction (which Callan seemed to despise) and they're more enjoyable for the students (another thing that Callan seems to be against--students enjoying class).

You're right that it can be right for some teachers and some students, but I'm not sure what your implication was with that statement. It's best for students who are willing to study hard and force themselves to memorize vocabulary. It's best for teachers who have good stamina (you're almost constantly talking for 50 minutes). Also, it's good for teachers who don't like to plan lessons, because the lessons are already planned.

We also have "social evenings." Every two weeks on Friday night we, the teachers and the students who want to go, go out to a restaurant/bar to socialize. It's a blast!

As far as the pay goes, Talk Talk pays by the hour ($15/hour), so you can teach as much, or as little, as you want.

The requirements to teach at Talk Talk are that you have to have a bachelor's degree (in anything) from an accredited university and you have to be a native speaker of English.

All that aside, the comment I made to the original poster a long time ago, which he or she evidently didn't like to hear because I didn't get a response, remains the same: Don't come here for the reason you said you want to come here. You will regret it if you do.

[Hoodoo Guru]

Hi, traveler.
Sorry, but don't assume I didn't like your post because I didn't reply!
I was just far from my computer for a while!As a matter of fact, Iv'e just sent you a PM.
Don't get me wrong, Talk Talk has a good reputation in UB and you can't fool that many happy students, can you?
And if teachers say there are happy at Talk Talk, I don't see a reason to doubt their sincerity,right?
I know the books have been rewritten, which is good, but I just don't like teaching standing behind a pulpit! Must be too old...
I know Trev and Patrick quite well, anyway, both of them ex-Hartford, just like me, by the way!

That said, I fully agree with you, traveler: coming to UB for the afore-mentionned reasons would definitely not be a good reason.
If you, enoch83, want to experience Mongolian wild west, come here for a holiday. You will have the time of your life, sure enough, but working in UB has nothing to do with the wild west...

[enoch83]

well guys, i guess i rest my case. thanks for all your answers and info. enjoy your life!

[traveler106]

Hi Hoodoo Guru,

Yes, it's nice to be working for a school with a good reputation. We do student surveys every now and then to check up on how satisfied our students are and to ask if they have any suggestions or complaints. Nearly every student says that he or she would recommend a friend to Talk Talk, and many of our new students come on referrals. So I guess we're doing something right.

It's also nice to see my students showing progress. Nearly all of them show at least a little improvement, but the ones who really work at it learn very fast. I have one who shows noticeable improvement by the week. She couldn't speak English at all when she started a little more than two months ago, now she can hold a simple conversation.

It can be pretty tiring to teach behind (and around) the lectern, though, so I understand your point. I think this country is making me age faster, since I get tired more easily now than I did a year ago. So I'm really looking forward to recharging for a couple weeks when I visit home next month.