Job Discussion Forums

[007]

[Axel Heidsman]

Another question: what is the general Saudi attitude to race? I notice that my school library has a DVD - Race - The Power of an Illusion - that argues that the concept of race has no genetic basis and that the modern idea of race based on skin color is a construct created to justify economic exploitation. The website linked to the DVD provides a lot of interesting discussion material. Would such discussions be likely to generate offense / trouble?

[brasscat]

In Saudi Arabia, and other places in Asia, the connotation is; the darker the skin the longer the person has worked outside in the sun. This indicates a person of manual labor, or minimally educated. Basicly, a person on the lowest rungs of society.

Also beware Saudi Arabia did have slavery until recent times. The slaves were most often African and denoted the lowest class in society.

From this you can infer the average Saudi's atititude.
brasscat

[007]

[johnslat]

Dear 007,

No country is free of prejudice, whether racial and/or of some other kind.
It's always a case, so to speak, of the pot calling the kettle black (sorry - I couldn't resist.)

But it is a fact that Saudi Arabia didn't outlaw slavery until 1962, fairly long after " . . . the creation of the Royaume of Saudi Arabia . ."

"The End of Legal Chattel SlaveryIt was the exploitation of oil that led to the end of legal chattel slavery in Arabia and the Gulf States. In these states oil companies began by hiring slaves from their owners, who naturally demanded a share of their pay. The bolder slaves refused. Owners soon found other sources of investment and slaves soon found paid jobs. 62 In 1952 oil rich Qatar freed its slaves and paid compensation to owners. Saudi Arabia followed suit in 1962. Yemen ended it after a coup, assisted by Egypt. In 1963, under British pressure, the Trucial states (now the United Arab Emirates) announced that slavery was not legal. They paid no compensation as oil had not yet begun to bring in revenues, but slaves were now free to seek work in the burgeoning oil economy."

http://www.yale-university.com/glc/events/cbss/Miers.pdf

And I think it's worth noting that although racism is certainly alive and sick in the USA today, it's beginning to look highly likely that a black man will be elected President of the USA in a little over three weeks.
I'd call that a sign of progress.

Oh, and as for brasscat's comment about skin color indicating social status, well, that was fairly universal back before it reversed itself:

"But the idea of Asian women obsessing over white skin troubles Glen Mimura, a 37-year-old assistant professor of Asian American studies at UC Irvine.
�It seems tied primarily to colonial history, a fascination with whiteness,� he said. �Dark skin gets associated with manual labor, agrarian communities, being less cosmopolitan.�

A "tan" used to indicate that one was working outside, usually doing manual labor. Nowadays, of course, it's the opposite. The only ones who can afford to lie on the beach and get skin cancer are those who are financially well-off, while we peons work mainly inside.

Regards,
John

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

Oh, John, oh, John...say permanent loss of the avatar ain't so!

NCTBA

[johnslat]

Dear NCTBA,

Hey, no problem. Just send your avatar here:


http://www.cathyvalencia.com/whiteningpeel.html

Regards,
John

[Never Ceased To Be Amazed]

Whew! O.K., I get it. At first, I thought you were having a stroke or certainly, a mis-stroke!

NCTBA

[brasscat]

I never said I supported any of the local atitudes, but nonetheless they do exist.

Not all skin color atitudes are based on the notion of slavery. In India, the caste system is still very powerful, the ligher skins being the higher castes. In Australia, the White/Aborigine divide is alive and well, again, no slavery.

These are not my ideas, nor do I support them, but they do exist. Knowing this and how to handle a local situation is important.
brasscat

[scot47]

I think for a lot of westerners coming to Saudi the problem is that they cannot stand having their basic assumptions challenged. Like their liberal ideas which are mainstream in some parts of the world but are seen as laughable in KSA...................... And their attitudes to race and "gender issues".

Faced with a society like KSA many of our pinko colleagues just cannot cope !

[sheikh radlinrol]