Job Discussion Forums

Buch · Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 16

I have worked in Korea, so I just want some answers to some stuff I am seeing in contracts to work in China.

In Korea they pay for your flight.

In China you have pay and get reimbursed.

Is that normal in China or can you get them to pay for your flight out there?

I notice that some of these schools want to pay me less in the begining for a probation period.

Is that illegal? Is that something I should complain about in the contract?

Any other tips about contracts in China?

mikefriend · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:18 am Post subject:

To answer your questions must school promise to reimburse you at the end of the contract. The reality is many schools don't honor this promise as some fire the teacher towards the end of the contract for a fictitious reason to save this expense.

Probationary period is usually a condition of working in a language mill. Many of these mills, like the few I spoke with in my area, are in need of teachers so if you want to hook up with one then be firm and tell them you don't agree for a lower pay for the first 3 months. Use their desperation to your advantage.

kev7161 · Joined: 06 Feb 2004 Posts: 5880 Location: Suzhou, China

Eyrick3 · Joined: 29 Mar 2008 Posts: 161 Location: Beijing, China

Buch · Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 16

Thanks for all the responses.

The one school wrote this to me after I told them my concern about the probation period.

The probation period is set by the government (the policy used to be three months probation). I understand and sympathize with the stress this can place someone under. I can approach the department head about waiving this, but given that you are "unknown" to the school, this is unlikely.

I think has to be BS about the probation period being set by the government?

Also, I complained that the company would only reimbure 1000 dollars, which is quite low for a plane ticket.

This is the response:

Flight:
Unfortunately, little can be done regarding the airfare payment. That rate was set last year and will be used for all contracts during the 2008-2009 school year.

They are only offering me 7000 RMB to begin with. That seems kind of low.

Also, they said the contract is a standard one, penned by the Foreign Experts Bureau, part of China's government. Given that, there is little that can be altered.

Any thoughts?

mikefriend · Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 4:15 am Post subject:

Buch · Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 16

[quote="mikefriend"][quote]Any thoughts?[/quote]

Yes standard replies from a standard contract from standard Chinese employees from a standard Chinese school.

They won't change their mind or ways regardless how bad they need a teacher .

So first NOTHING is set and they show you unwillingness to negotiate with you.

[quote]Also, they said the contract is a standard one, penned by the Foreign Experts Bureau, part of China's government. Given that, there is little that can be altered. [/quote]

Means only that they used an existing contract from somewhere else but may - probably did- change the parts they wanted to. Standard or customized it really doesn't mean much.

If it smells like doodie and looks like doodie to you really have to taste it to find out what it is?

You have to take the gamble and go in knowing what the terms are and they wont change them for you.[/quote]

Yeah the schools really don't want to negotiate at all, which makes it a little difficult.

I have been getting some offers where I would go there on a tourist visa for a month or two. Then they would process a Z Visa.

I know in Korea working on a tourist visa is illegal. I have questioned the owners of some of the schools in China.

Is this the same in China? If yes, what are the consequences?

lf_aristotle69 · Joined: 06 May 2006 Posts: 546 Location: HangZhou, China

Buch · Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 16

[quote="lf_aristotle69"][quote="Buch"]I have been getting some offers where I would go there on a tourist visa for a month or two. Then they would process a Z Visa.

I know in Korea working on a tourist visa is illegal. I have questioned the owners of some of the schools in China.

Is this the same in China? If yes, what are the consequences?[/quote]

You haven't seen the STICKY on the top half of the China Job Topics Forum page?

Click here --> [url=http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=48879]Working on a tourist visa. Is that bad?[/url]

Thanks I did not see it. This is a real problem with some of these contracts.

LFA[/quote]

lf_aristotle69 · Joined: 06 May 2006 Posts: 546 Location: HangZhou, China

Some schools mean what they say... some don't.

Some just want to get a look at you first and see if you "fit in"... if not then it's "sorry there's a problem, you have to go now"... the problem will be yours!

All schools that are legally able to employ foreigners are also legally able to get the correct paperwork together for you to apply for the proper Z work visa in your country before you come to China. Better to keep looking for one that will get you the proper paperwork. Be careful of being strung along until it gets so late that "you have to come over on a tourist visa first, and we'll finish the work visa processing when you arrive"...

If you get the proper Z entry visa, then once you are in China that single entry Z visa is upgraded to a Work purposes Resident Permit, which is multi-exit/entry.

If you come over on a tourist visa, there may still be lots of hoops to jump through (maybe a trip to HongKong (at who's expense???)) and it may not even be possible to get a work permit.

Good luck.

LFA

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

got lost a little on this thread. Someone needs to learn to use the quote button better.

Overall, few schools will ever pay for your flight upfront. Should be reimbursed within a month.

Salary and living conditions are and should be negotiated.

Basic wording of the standard part of the contract is meaningless, thus the school won't negotiate. For instance probation period rarely has any meaning. Never heard of a school yet that had a meaningful probation period in which they objectively critiqued your work, and then asked you to leave due to poor performance

it's in the contract becuse it has to be, don't think about it