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Ramblin' Man
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Posts: 105
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 Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 3:39 pm Post subject: Teaching University without a BA! |
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Hey all,
I am new to these boards, but not totally new to teaching abroad. I taught esl last year in China at the early primary and Kindergarten levels. I did enjoy teaching the little kids overall. The were, of course, very cute and full of life/energy.
I now want to try my hand at teaching University. It just seems like it may be the right fit for me, and is very appealing. The only problem is I don't have a BA. I have a high school diploma (probably obvious,) a TESOL certificate and 1 year teaching expierence in China.
I have seen some jobs posted on another website that say they prefer but don't require a degree for teaching in their University, but I don't know how legit they are.
Can anybody give me some idea of how easy/hard it would be for me to get a job teaching University without a degree? |
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brsmith15
Joined: 12 May 2003
Posts: 1142
Location: New Hampshire USA
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| In one word: nearlyimpossible. |
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Eyrick3
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 161
Location: Beijing, China
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| Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:08 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| In one word: nearlyimpossible. |
I agree and disagree.
The best paying universities (the one's that pay 6000+ for 14 hour contracts) won't hire you.
However, I'm sure you could find a 4000 RMB/month 25 hour contract with some of the lesser known (smaller) universities.
You could also try your hand at an advanced TESOL diploma, such as a Masters of TESOL. Many schools would consider that, and more teaching experience, in lieu of a degree. |
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Laoshi1950
Joined: 22 May 2004
Posts: 198
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:13 am Post subject: |
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| The university that I work at in Beijing will only consider for employment those teachers who have either a Master's degree or a PhD. Previous successful teaching experience at home and/or in China is also preferred. |
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North China Laowei
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 419
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| Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:42 am Post subject: My Own Experience |
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| Eyrick3 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| In one word: nearlyimpossible. |
I agree and disagree.
The best paying universities (the one's that pay 6000+ for 14 hour contracts) won't hire you.
However, I'm sure you could find a 4000 RMB/month 25 hour contract with some of the lesser known (smaller) universities.
You could also try your hand at an advanced TESOL diploma, such as a Masters of TESOL. Many schools would consider that, and more teaching experience, in lieu of a degree. |
I agree with what most of the above-poster has written. I am personally aware of universities in the hinterland (Hunan, Sichuan, Xinjiang, Heilongjiang) that will hire without a BA if there is a TESOL certificate and two years demonstrated teaching experience.
I disagree with the above, however in that a Master's of Education in TESOL or whatever is a "degree", in fact it is probably two-to-three years beyond a Bachelor's degree. |
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JohnC
Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 47
Location: London
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| Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 2:36 am Post subject: |
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| Eyrick3 wrote: |
| You could also try your hand at an advanced TESOL diploma, such as a Masters of TESOL. Many schools would consider that, and more teaching experience, in lieu of a degree. |
I'm sure if one has a Masters degree in TESOL, they will get a job in China.
As noted above, you do of course realise that a Masters degree comes after a bachelor degree.
And least if you go to a reputable school to earn it. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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| JohnC wrote: |
| Eyrick3 wrote: |
| You could also try your hand at an advanced TESOL diploma, such as a Masters of TESOL. Many schools would consider that, and more teaching experience, in lieu of a degree. |
I'm sure if one has a Masters degree in TESOL, they will get a job in China.
As noted above, you do of course realise that a Masters degree comes after a bachelor degree.
And least if you go to a reputable school to earn it. |
Most MA Ed programs (USA based) are 3-years long and you must already have a Bachelor's degree (often prior teaching experience is required too). 2-years is classroom instruction with the 3rd year devoted to teaching certification, a research practicum and various endorsements.
My endorsements are in Bilingual Education and TESOL.
NO shortcut for getting these credentials from a Reputable University.
BEWARE of any university that claims you can get this degree online or in less than 1-year. At best, that kind of degree might fool a few lower-end Chinese schools but will come back to haunt you if you go back to your host country for a real teaching job or try to move into the higher-paid international circuits. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Laoshi1950 wrote: |
| The university that I work at in Beijing will only consider for employment those teachers who have either a Master's degree or a PhD. Previous successful teaching experience at home and/or in China is also preferred. |
Even with a coveted MA Ed /TESOL or a PhD in TESOL, the same low-end jobs and unscrupulous recruiters will await you in the Chinese market. As I mentioned before, if you have a higher education, experience and do a good job often you end up with extra unpaid hours and various tasks.
The extra pay (maybe 300 RMB more a month) will not materialize for top credentials. You must investigate and pick your positions carefully.
Recruiters and sham-schools seems to be more "interested and pushy" if you have some type of advanced qualifications and will be more "creative" to get you to accept a lower-tiered position. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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I forgot to answer the OP question. It is almost impossible to teach under a legit Z-visa in the university circuits in the top big cities without a bachelor's degree.
If the university is ranked and hires unqualified teachers they will "lose face." Students will complain they are "failing English" because the teacher isn't qualified.
Thus, the policies at the higher-end universities in places like Beijing is exactly what Laoshi1950 posted.
Most universities will require Master's or PhD instructors/ or at the least certified teachers with verified experience from their home country.
This change started to develop in the last few years as requirements tightened and the supply of teachers increased.
(Note: Some recruiters and institutions will submit fake credentials to retain and employ a FT. The FT sometimes does not know this was done. However, it seems this is more difficult to do these days for the top-end positions.) |
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North China Laowei
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 419
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| Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 3:25 am Post subject: |
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| SnoopBot wrote: |
I forgot to answer the OP question. It is almost impossible to teach under a legit Z-visa in the university circuits in the top big cities without a bachelor's degree.
If the university is ranked and hires unqualified teachers they will "lose face." Students will complain they are "failing English" because the teacher isn't qualified.
Thus, the policies at the higher-end universities in places like Beijing is exactly what Laoshi1950 posted.
Most universities will require Master's or PhD instructors/ or at the least certified teachers with verified experience from their home country.
This change started to develop in the last few years as requirements tightened and the supply of teachers increased.
(Note: Some recruiters and institutions will submit fake credentials to retain and employ a FT. The FT sometimes does not know this was done. However, it seems this is more difficult to do these days for the top-end positions.) |
You have qualified the OP's original request. He did not limit his question as to whether or not he could teach at one of the best universities in China without a first-level university degree.
He asked a much broader question.
And the answer to that question remains, "yes", it is highly possible, particularly outside of BJ, SH, GZ, HZ, etc. If he has a TESOL certificate and some demonstrated experience, with or without the help of a recruiter he should be able to secure himself a position.
And this is based upon my own personal experience with persons in similar situations. |
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Ramblin' Man
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 3:56 am Post subject: |
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Hey, OP here, thanks for the responses everyone.
It's true that I did ask a broad question, and that is because I have an interest in teaching University even if it isn't at the highest levels.
| Quote: |
And the answer to that question remains, "yes", it is highly possible, particularly outside of BJ, SH, GZ, HZ, etc. If he has a TESOL certificate and some demonstrated experience, with or without the help of a recruiter he should be able to secure himself a position.
And this is based upon my own personal experience with persons in similar situations. |
This interest me North China Laowei. Perhaps you could expand upon this a little.
I assume this means you are aware of legitimate Universities that would hire somebody with my credentials (or lack thereof) and not whole in the wall operations.
Also what would the pay level be at these Universities?
If you would be willing to pm me with any contacts you have that might help me further, it would be very much appreciated. |
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North China Laowei
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 419
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| Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:10 am Post subject: See Below |
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Dear Ramblin' Man,
I will PM you later today or tomorrow with some contacts for you.
Regards,
NCL |
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Ramblin' Man
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:34 am Post subject: |
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Alright NCL, sounds good.
Thanks in advance. |
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