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rotorjoc
Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Posts: 2
Location: Missouri, USA
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 Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:17 pm Post subject: Questions about aviation experience for teaching |
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Hi,
I'm interested in anyone who has experience teaching english to aviation professionals.
A little background: I hold an Fedreal Aviation Administration (FAA) commerical instrument helicopter pilots license. I also have FAA certificates for Airframe and Power Plant mechanic for aircraft and a BS degree in Aviation Management. I currently work for a large helicopter emergency medical service in operational control.
So, I've got quite a bit of aviation experience. Although I don't have any certifications for teaching english, I have taught classes in aviation subjects for my company and have worked as a subsitute teacher for 3rd grade through highschool.
I've also owned several businesses that aren't aviation related And have publsihed feature articles on avaiton subjects.
I've looked through the forums and seen a few questions regarding aviation but most of the posters didn't have any experience.
Of course I would be interested in teaching english in any capacity, but this seemed like a route that might be available to me.
Thanks in advance,
Tom |
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MikeySaid
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 509
Location: Torreon, Mexico
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| Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 7:23 am Post subject: |
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It seems the deadline recently passed for current intl pilots to have a certain level of English, but I am often wrong.
However, it will probably be heartening to know that in Torreon, Mexico, I've been approached by two different pilots looking for English classes. That is to say, I'm nowhere important. If you could get a CELTA or some other quality certificate and position yourself near a good flight training school or metropolitan area, you could possibly make it a niche offering. However, you'd probably still have to supplement your income teaching us land-faring stiffs how to talk good english. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 7:42 am Post subject: |
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| Seems like a terribly limited field. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:04 am Post subject: |
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| I know that Eurocontrol recently set English language standards and hired an instructor- but I can say that extensive aviation experience PLUS an MA in TEFL/TESL or Applied Linguistics PLUS extensive experience teaching English as a second language were all required. (I happen to know the 'winning' teacher well) |
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Justin Trullinger
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit
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| Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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Hi,
I'm the director of a language center in Ecuador that is involved in aviation English teaching and testing. If you haven't contacted me privately, Tom, please feel free to. We've been at this in varying capacities for 3 and a half years, and it's been good for us.
Some thoughts:
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It seems the deadline recently passed for current intl pilots to have a certain level of English, but I am often wrong.
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Not completely wrong, not completely right either. ICAO regs started the transition from English as a recommended language to English as a required language for international radiotelephonic communication in aviation in March 2003. The "new" requirement applies to pilots, air traffic controllers, and ground station (weather station, mostly) staff.
An important date was passed last year in March, but it isn't the end of the road. In somewhat simplified terms, this was the date by which local, meaning national, civil aviation authorities had to have implimented a testing and licensing system, and to have tested and published results of certain categories of license holders, as a step towards eventually complete compliance.
But it was not actually the final date for compiance, just a check point in the road.
I won't publish the actual final ICAO compliance date here, in case pilots are reading. Because the civil aviation administration of each country is free to impose stricter requirements, but cannot relax them. (Some countries are trying to reach the minimum levels before the ICAO final date but none can postpone the requirements.)
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| Seems like a terribly limited field. |
Hasn't seemed so to me. THough there are clearly fewer pilots than there are, say, businesspeople looking to learn English, the stakes are quite different. In the long term, these are students who can't give up, can't change their minds, and can't postpone. THeir careers are on the line. Our center has employed at least 2, and more frequently 3-4, at one point 6, teachers dedicated exclusively to aviation English, for the last three years. GIven that we're a small center, this is big for us. And it could easily have been more, but for infrastructure concerns. (Meaning space.)
THis reg applies to everyone using the radio in flight circumstances, so it's quite a lot of people who will be needing to learn. I image that, when final dates pass, there won't be as much work, but for the moment, there should be lots. When the dates pass, and we've got a little while, I imagine that those who got the best experience now will still find work training newly qualified pilots.
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| I know that Eurocontrol recently set English language standards and hired an instructor- but I can say that extensive aviation experience PLUS an MA in TEFL/TESL or Applied Linguistics PLUS extensive experience teaching English as a second language were all required. (I happen to know the 'winning' teacher well) |
I don't know Eurocontrol, Spiral, but I know about where you're located. It sounds to me like that's one teacher at the high end of the market- I would expect that a fair number of lesser-qualified "grunts" are going to be needed at some point. Though this is less sure where you are, because throughout Europe, language training for pilots is already reasonably okay. Outside of Europe, though, it's a much different story. Studies of Latin America indicate that, at least 70% of pilots will require either some training or extensive training to achieve the required level.
Remember that there are some tens of thousands of pilots per country on average, and you come round to the fact that we aren't going ot have MA TESOLs teaching them all.
Best,
Justin
PS- Hopefully, 2009, the School for International Training will be offering a certification in Teaching English for Aviation. Look for it! |
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rotorjoc
Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Posts: 2
Location: Missouri, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 3:46 pm Post subject: Thanks for the great posts so far! |
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Thanks for the information gentlemen.
I have been interested in teaching English, mostly because I like to travel and have enjoyed living in other countries (mostly courtesy of the military).
I just thought that the aviation background might give me a niche that might give me a leg up. I've read through the boards and have seen that a Bachelors degree was enough in some instances. I am currently working but thought about looking at getting a certificate in my spare time, I don't know which one would be the most convienent to obtain and at the same time prove most valuable.
It sounds like it is working out well for your company Justin. It would seem to me that there are always going to be folks getting into avaition and needing to learn English.
I've just begun to explore the possibilities with this. Again, thannks for the information, and keep it coming if anyone else has advice, about aviation or any other teaching English subjects.
Justin, I will try to find some time tonight to write you, (I've doing to overnight shift tonight).
Tom |
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Sinko
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Fri Jan 30, 2009 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Tom,
I have been teaching Aviation English in China for the last 3 years. I am heavily involved with the 2 Civil Aviation Universities as well as some companies.
PM me with your details. I would also be interested in what other people on this forum had to say about this subject.
Regards,
S. |
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TT-Kira
Joined: 04 Mar 2008
Posts: 62
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| Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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Tom
I can't PM you, can you PM me please, would like to know more about your search!
Kira |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Mon Apr 27, 2009 2:49 am Post subject: |
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Michael Faudree and Arata Fujimaki have written a textbook for aviation engineers: Basic English for Science and Technology. (Eihosha publisher)
I think Oxford publisher may also have one on ESP for Aviation.
http://www.oupjapan.co.jp/store/oupjapan |
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D'yankee
Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 44
Location: Dallas, Tx, USA
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| Posted: Fri May 15, 2009 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Sinko,
Can you pm me with any info on an aviation schools in Chengdu. I can't pm anyone yet.
Thanks,
D'yankee |
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dialogger
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 419
Location: China
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pt2323
Joined: 25 Jun 2009
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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| I have extensive experience in teaching aviation English in preparation for the ICAO English test. What I have noted is that often students and teachers of avaiation English miss the point. This test is a test of the student's ability to speak plain English and it is not a test of the student's knowledge of aviation...........and there is a big difference. My task is always to train the student's to stop thinking about the information and start thinking about the English. Furthermore I feel that the best aviation teachers are NOT from an aviation background. Too much avaition knowledge simply focusses the questions/answers towards the information and away from the English. |
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dialogger
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 419
Location: China
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| Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:51 pm Post subject: Aviation English |
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| Good points pt |
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Sinko
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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| pt2323 wrote: |
| I have extensive experience in teaching aviation English in preparation for the ICAO English test. What I have noted is that often students and teachers of avaiation English miss the point. This test is a test of the student's ability to speak plain English and it is not a test of the student's knowledge of aviation...........and there is a big difference. My task is always to train the student's to stop thinking about the information and start thinking about the English. Furthermore I feel that the best aviation teachers are NOT from an aviation background. Too much avaition knowledge simply focusses the questions/answers towards the information and away from the English. |
Well this is half right, pt. Most of the english that pilots are directly involved in, is communication with ATC. There is a Pilot/ATC com jargon that is used all the time throughout the world, when pilots are issued with clearances, instructions and information. Common coms are things like ATIS, clearances, airport taxi instructions, instrument flight routes (also GPS routes), etc. A lot of it too is abbreviated, especially in busy centres.
While the emphasis should be on speaking and understanding general english, if a pilot doesn't understand a clearance, for example, he's incapable of flying.
A lot, too, depends on how the local exams are set. Here in China, there is probably too much emphasis on aviation knowledge, but if that's what CAAC they want, so be it. There is always an interview at the end and this is where the pilots must get their general english up to scratch.
An aviation english experienced person is more likely to have success and enjoyment dealing with pilots than one without flight knowledge. As an ATCer (with a pilot's licence) in the past, I get along so much better with my students than my fellow inexperienced teachers. The pilots appreciate it better because we are on the same wavelength.
I'm not trying to detract other teachers from applying for these positions, but I have seen some very good general english teachers unable to answer simple questions from the pilots which puts the teacher in an awkward position. An embarrassing one, at times. The pilot student gets pee'd off and doesn't come back to class.
Anyway, good luck to all you aspiring applicants. The job will keep you busy..  |
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dialogger
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 419
Location: China
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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Since my last contribution I have seen on "Serious Teachers" an aviation English school in China, advertising for native speakers with aviation English experience.
If OP still looking perhaps he/she can PM me and I'll see if I can locate the link. |
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