Job Discussion Forums

[CanadianProf]

Hello Everyone,

I have been reading these forums and it is very informative.

I am considering an academic Prof position at PSU (not English), and just wondering a couple things.

Is the housing inside an actual compound or no?

And I have a very small old lapdog, would it be possible to have a dog there?

Would I have to take a shuttle van with the other teachers? Because that seems kinda risky from a security standpoint, even in Egypt I didn't take the shuttle bus for foreigners...

Finally, do the women wear a hijab in class?

I would appreciate any imput...

[Cleopatra]

[CanadianProf]

Thanks for the fast reply Cleo

So in terms of the housing situation, it it at all conducive to having a dog? I had her with me in Kuwait and she was ok, we rarely went for walks and she stayed on the balcony occasionally.

I have been reading these forums but sometimes people use the short form PSU and they mean Prince Saud University... can you confirm that all that stuff on here about Bell recruitment is not about Prince Sultan University?

[Cleopatra]

[johnslat]

Dear CanadianProf,
I brought a dog, a Shih Tzu, to Saudi Arabia way back in 1980. I had to get the required permission from the embassy in Washington, and, of course, to get that, the dog had to have had all the necessary shots.
Twenty-nine years ago, pets in general and dogs specifically, were VERY uncommon in the Kingdom. Packs of feral dogs roamed the empty lots in Jeddah - until they were all disposed of by the police with poison. I had to do all the grooming myself, dog food was hard to find, and thank God the dog never got sick because I doubt I could have turned up a vet who would have treated him.
When I brought the dog into the country, I was stopped at Customs and, despite the fact that I had all the "necessary papers", the dog was confiscated, and I was told he'd be "shipped back." Fortunately, the Director of the IPA was able to use some "wasta", and Chu Lai (the dog's name) was finally allowed into the Kingdom.
He stayed with me for three years there - and, since I was by myself at the time, that poor dog was by himself in the apartment often from 6:30 am to 7:30 p.m. Yet never once did he "do his business" in the house. Of course, by the time I got home, he'd practically be bouncing off the walls.
And when I took him out for "walkies", well, from the looks the locals gave me, I might as well have had a tiger on the leash.
But some Saudi colleagues fell for him, in spite of the fact that many Muslims consider dogs to be "unclean:"

"Dogs are considered unclean according to some who study Islamic law. However, a Saluki, such as above, is in some cases cherished by Muslims.
Dogs are mentioned in the holy book of Islam the Quran several times e.g. in the main story of sura 18 where a dog is a companion of the dwellers of the Cave. The Quran also tells that it is permissible to eat what trained dogs catch (5:4). Nevertheless, many Islamic teachers state dogs should be considered unclean and that Muslims licked by them must perform purification. According to a Sunni Islam Hadith, a plate that a dog has used for feeding must be washed seven times for a person to eat from, however this was prior to the availablity of soap and other disinfectants [6]. The number of times it should be washed signifies that great care should be taken before eating in that plate as it might spread certain diseases to humans.
According to the majority of Sunni scholars, dogs can be owned by farmers, hunters, and shepherds, for the purpose of hunting and guarding.
Another exception appears to be made by the Bedouin in the case of the Saluki. They are allowed in the tents and considered special companions."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unclean_animals#Dogs

But the Hadith also mention this:

"'A man walking along a path felt very thirsty. Reaching a well he descended into it, drank his fill and came up. Then he saw a dog with its tongue hanging out, trying to lick up mud to quench its thirst. The man saw that the dog was feeling the same thirst as he had felt so he went down into the well again and filled his shoe with water and gave the dog a drink. God forgave his sins for this action.' The Prophet (SAW) was asked: 'Messenger of God, are we rewarded for kindness towards animals?' He said, 'There is a reward for kindness to every living thing.' (From the hadith collections of Bukhari, Muslim, Tirmidhi and Bayhaqi.)"

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/introduction/understandingislam.html

One Saudi colleague, Big Faisal (he was about 6' 5" and weighed around 250 lbs.) became especially attached and would come down and play with Chu for hours. Finally, though, I took him back to the States and he found a home with my sister there.
Nowadays, it's very different. When I left in 2003, there were pet stores, dog food was easily available at Safeway supermarkets, and even some Saudis had dogs as pets, so vets weren't hard to find. I wasn't even living on a compound when I had my dog, just in a regular apartment house. But if you're on a compound, that would be much better - for you AND the dog.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
John

[Asda]

As far as I know and if I'm not mistaken, the hadith you mention was actually about a prostitute who gave the thirsty dog a drink of water from her shoe and was entered into Paradise solely on the basis of her mercy to God's creation, so God consequently showed her His Mercy...

[johnslat]

Dear Asda,
I believe, if you will do one or two Google searches, you will find that there are actually two different Hadith regarding giving water to a dog. I was aware of the other one, as well.

"Hadith (Sayings) is a term used primarily for collections of sayings of Muhammad ibn Abdullah that have been collected as guidance for followers of the Muslim traditions. There are tens of thousands of hadith that are attributed to him, and a compilation of hadith without commentary alone could fill an encyclopedia of books.

A prostitute was forgiven by Allah, because, passing by a panting dog near a well and seeing that the dog was about to die of thirst, she took off her shoe, and tying it with her head-cover she drew out some water for it. So, Allah forgave her because of that.
(Bukhari 4:538 This is an extraordinary hadith, because following the Sunnah of Muhammad, prostitutes can be extremely despised figures among most Muslims, yet it expresses the idea that even someone working in one of the most despised of professions, in showing mercy to an animal, can merit the forgiveness of Allah, and the wise. It is in many ways comparable to Yeshua's (Jesus Christ's) parable of the good Samaritan.)"

" While a man was walking along a road, he became very thirsty and found a well. He lowered himself into the well, drank, and came out. Then [he saw] a dog protruding its tongue out with thirst. The man said: 'This dog has become exhausted from thirst in the same way as I.' He lowered himself into the well again and filled his shoe with water. He gave the dog some water to drink. He thanked God, and [his sins were] forgiven.' The Prophet was then asked: 'Is there a reward for us in our animals?' He said: 'There is a reward in every living thing.' "
Fiqh-us-Sunnah, Volume 3, Number 104."

http://www.spaceandmotion.com/religion-islam-muslim-islamic-quran.htm

Thanks,
John

[Gulezar]

Finally, do the women wear a hijab in class?

I was told abaya in public and NO abaya in class with the girls.

I was told no head cover when I was recruited. Then gradually it went to:

1. head cover going to school (the school required it to be acceptable in the neighborhood)
to
2. in the store or on the way (the populace demanded it)
to
3. in one's own home if seen by others from outside. Your fault if someone looked in an open window and saw you with hair uncovered.

Yes, others will tell you that this was not their experience, but you never know what you could encounter in Saudi.

[balqis]

I worked for two establishments that tried to ban hejab wearing for the female students [ they perceived their educational mission as ''progressive'' for Arabia ]; also teachers were asked not to wear abayas, let alone hejabs, while being at the unis. Many girls wanted to wear the abaya or hejab and that sparked off smaller and mightier arguments. Abaya can be also very useful as a coat, for a variety of sound reasons, for example protecting you against blazing air-conditioning in class to mention but a one.

Showing your hair makes you stand out like a lamp post while going anywhere public in Arabia. Do you want to stand out like a lamp post? And be a sort of a visual sore? Or even if not a sore, then a visual landmark, if not a visual pleasure, especially if you are pretty?
Well, even if you think you want, it is not at all easy to bear it once you emerge yourself into the depth of the Arab rules of beholding, with the depth's strange code. You may/will/ soon feel a strong urge to become less visible and more blended in with the visual field of Arabia and their mode of perception.

Plus you may also - against your own expectations and appropriated standards of moaning of western expat females in Arabia - fall in love with hejab, as it happened to me. Hejab may be considered beautiful. Its looks; and its meaning as well.

balqis

[CanadianProf]

Thanks everyone for posting your thoughts and experiences.

[scot47]

Like John S I remember the packs of feral "pariah" dogs in the streets of Jeddah in the 1970's. Exterminated now but replaced by feral cats. Not quite so threatening.