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Loudspeakers and mosques
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Vertumnus



Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 142
Location: Indonesia

PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 4:29 am    Post subject: Disturbances Reply with quote

Back home, I was disturbed by lots of noise: gunfire, fireworks, stereos, cars, parties, church bells, drunkards, fights and, once, a riot in my apartment complex.

Here, I get disturbed by roosters that don't know when to crow, bebek with terrible mufflers, mosques (5xday), late night weddings and, during religious holidays, fireworks and parties.

I've come to the conclusion there're few places in the world where you can escape the people who are rude and inconsiderate (or righteous) enough to make lots of noise.

Thus, I've learned to not get riled up by most noises. I can sleep through the mosques' call to prayer, the roosters crowing and the late night parties. I am still working on the fireworks and bebek. If you don't allow yourself to become annoyed, then you're much more likely to be able to sleep through the disturbances.

I couldn't sleep in Bandung because of all the stupid roosters. Now, I can sleep in the house of chicken farmers and have no trouble.

Calm your mind and things will be easier.... Laughing

-D
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malu



Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 1344
Location: Sunny Java

PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update to this one:

Two weeks ago myself and a posse of neighbours appealed to the village head in the kampung that borders the complex where I live and asked him to mediate with the imam of the kampung mosque.

As a result the loudspeaker that was previously pointed directly at us has now been repositioned and - so far - the kids' screeching contests have been conducted using the indoor loudspeakers only.
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Vertumnus



Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 142
Location: Indonesia

PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 2:17 am    Post subject: Excellent! Reply with quote

malu wrote:
An update to this one:

Two weeks ago myself and a posse of neighbours appealed to the village head in the kampung that borders the complex where I live and asked him to mediate with the imam of the kampung mosque.

As a result the loudspeaker that was previously pointed directly at us has now been repositioned and - so far - the kids' screeching contests have been conducted using the indoor loudspeakers only.


CHEER! Congratulations, malu! You must be pleased as punch! Razz

-D
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ESL Hobo



Joined: 23 Oct 2008
Posts: 262

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeepers Malu,

Don't you feel even a little ashamed of what you and your "posse" have done?
How will the neighborhood students react when finding out?
Even using the word "posse " sounds aggressive.

Don't you think that some people in the surrounding community might be offended and decide not to send their kids to your school?

Is your complex completely non-Islam in faith?
Do you think the Imam was intentionally targeting your complex for conversion or harassment?
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laughing_magpie06



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 282

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 2:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESL hobo, I don't get it. Surely in any civilised society the majority can respect the wishes of the minority to some degree. When muslims wake up non muslims and use loudspeakers throughout the day and night whenever they celebrate something they are showing disrespect towards everyone else who happens to live nearby. People have to sleep, work, conduct business etc and can't all put up with it. I applaud malu for what he did and hope it's the start of a bright new future.
Imagine if in the west I had muslim neigbours and got publicly drunk on my street and dressed in a 'risque' manner, how would they react? I wonder what people, including my own race, would say if my only reply was 'when in rome'.
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ESL Hobo



Joined: 23 Oct 2008
Posts: 262

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi LMP,
I am trying to keep this on the topic of how it affects teaching and school in the community.

Luckily, Indonesia is a democratic country, accepts many major religious practices and are very tolerant of foreigners.

How do think the students feel about having a "posse" show up at the village head's office? Did the posse ask politely or did they demand and assert their rights? Did the "posse" consist of all foreigners or some nationals as well?

I guess Malu will be able answer these questions.
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Shadow2009



Joined: 20 Dec 2008
Posts: 27
Location: W.A.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:01 am    Post subject: Privacy Reply with quote

Dear ESL Hobo

I assume from your comments that you discuss your private affairs with your students ?

What Malu does in Malu's private life is no concern of students, parents, employers or anybody else as long as it is within the law.
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malu



Joined: 22 Apr 2007
Posts: 1344
Location: Sunny Java

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESL Hobo wrote:


Is your complex completely non-Islam in faith?
Do you think the Imam was intentionally targeting your complex for conversion or harassment?


I was one of two non-Muslims in a posse of eight. Thoughtless noise pollution affects Muslims just as much as it affects me.

Apparently the leaders of another mosque in the area also complained that the racket was interfering with their prayers.

And no, I don't feel any shame in the slightest.
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ESL Hobo



Joined: 23 Oct 2008
Posts: 262

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK
Sounds like perhaps it was handled rather well.
After all I wasn't there and don't know all the circumstances.

Thanks for your input.
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Vertumnus



Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 142
Location: Indonesia

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 2:31 am    Post subject: noisy mosques Reply with quote

ESL Hobo wrote:
hi LMP,
I am trying to keep this on the topic of how it affects teaching and school in the community.

Luckily, Indonesia is a democratic country, accepts many major religious practices and are very tolerant of foreigners.

How do think the students feel about having a "posse" show up at the village head's office? Did the posse ask politely or did they demand and assert their rights? Did the "posse" consist of all foreigners or some nationals as well?

I guess Malu will be able answer these questions.


As I think has been mentioned elsewhere, there are Muslim authorities who point out that, in the Koran, it states that it is incorrect to disturb other people who are praying when you do the call to prayer. Thus, the tendency of many mosques to announce, quite loudly, over loudspeakers that it's time to pray when other mosques nearby have already done so and are, therefore, already praying, is wrong and should be avoided.

I guess we should demand that the mosques stop using the loudspeakers! Smile

Related to this subject is the fact that, in this country, it is considered appropriate to go to the chieftain of your area (or the offending area) to resolve problems. The chieftain will go to the "offending" party and work to resolve the issue without you being directly involved. This is in line with the Eastern concept of harmonious resolution of problems and minimizes the chance of people becoming upset.

Case in point: my neighbor's house is full of people who are friends of the owner's kids - all the time. It's like a free boarding house. The owner is a shrink. Last year, our community was disturbed by late-night usage of fireworks, and people were unhappy. Finally, after several breaches, the chieftain of our community approached them and told them (politely) to stop. The young punks stopped. Smile

I believe malu's use of "posse" was to represent how strongly he felt about the situation, rather than to say that he actually formed a posse (which would be an incorrect usage in this context, since a posse is a group of people deputized and lead by the authorities to hunt down and capture fugitives/criminals).

I believe the strong reaction of some of the others was because you worded your post rather strongly and even, dare I say, rudely, thus violating the community rules of harmony on Dave's ESL Cafe. I do not mean to affront you, merely to point out that you might want to be more delicate in your approach... Peace! Smile

-D)
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laughing_magpie06



Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 282

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESL hobo, are you bule or Indonesian? Why you ask? Because you would be the very first minority to say Indonesia practices racial and religious tolerance with a straight face if the former.
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