Job Discussion Forums

jgmodlin · Joined: 01 Mar 2006 Posts: 120 Location: USA

Texas_blu, you mentioned that you were working in HCMC with wife and baby in tow. That is what I am also planning to do this summer or fall.

If you don't mind me asking, has it been easy enough for them too? My wife is Japanese and doesn't really have ties to our current home here in Richmond, Va, so I figure she'd be okay. I just wasn't sure if it is hard to get the baby around what with all the bikes whizzing around and probably no option to drive. I saw the rent you mentioned doesn't look to bad, with the wages you're able to get there are you all able to save money too?

I want to come over this summer but still have some trepidation having a family to provide for. If single and unencumbered, I wouldn't give it a second thought. What do ya'll think?

Texas_blu · Joined: 26 Oct 2008 Posts: 108 Location: HCMC, VN

My situation is still different than yours as my wife is Vietnamese which is truly an asset. She isn't the best at finding bargains but she's VN and someone will help her - it's the VN way. Still, there are quite a lot of Japanese here mostly in District 1 but most of those are living the high life.

I save money but I've been here for 4 years and have learned where the high paying jobs are at. A lot of trail and error in the process. So much depends on your credentials and your ability to be "street smart". The VN's will take advantage if you let them and it takes a while to learn how much is too much and how much is too little. Every culture is different.

But having a baby here could be quite the disadvantage until you learn where to get the best deals as babies can't wait.

Maybe you should consider coming here first by yourself to get the ball rolling and have them follow in 3 - 6 months unless you've got a load of cash lying around.

A new "fresh off the boat" person makes the VN salivate. Good luck and happy hunting.

ajc19810 · Joined: 22 May 2008 Posts: 214

inky · Joined: 05 Jan 2009 Posts: 283 Location: Hanoi

I disagree with the characterization of Vietnamese "salivating" over a new arrival. You make it sound like a prison. You make it sound like the Vietnamese are all hanging around the arrivals area at the airport rubbing their hands together. I'd be as worried about being misled or scammed by an ex-pat as by a Vietnamese. The reality is that if you get a job at a decent school you will find lots of support, both with school-related issues and with issues around settling in to your new home, both from the foreign staff and from the local staff. Most people are kind and concerned, and most Vietnamese are particularly interested in the welfare of children and babies.

I'd hesitate bringing a newborn here because of the noise and pollution, but not out of fear of the locals. Yes, there is a dual-pricing deal here in some situations, but it usually involves cents, not dollars. And the modern supermarkets and other businesses have their prices displayed.

That's good advice about sending a scouting party out in advance, especially to find a proper living situation. I wouldn't want to be here staying in a guesthouse while house-hunting.

thomas123 · Joined: 10 Mar 2008 Posts: 26

Texas:

You rented a house for under $100 per month !! That's practically free. Was it in a decent area?

sammie08 · Joined: 30 Nov 2008 Posts: 13 Location: Argentina

I've been looking for housing for about a week, in that time, what I have found is that bigger places are simply nicer than single-person housing. The single person housing that I have found had less by way of: kitchen amenities, bathroom amenities, tv's, balconies, and in general, the feel/ decoration/ atmosphere. In addition, you'll end up paying more for these lovely amenities.
The houses I have seen are generally better furnished, have sounder internet, better lighting and atmosphere, generally they have a rooftop terrace of some kind and a fully outfitted kitchen.... for less! Often for much less. Many times you'll get your own bathroom as well and all the bills get split so a cleaning lady will be 1/4, internet will be 1/4 and, a biggie I never thought of before coming here, in a house you'll have guaranteed 24-hour access. Apartment buildings are often times locked, even during the day, by the landlord who has the only set of keys. I cringe at the idea of trying to wake a 70-year old, decrepit landlord up at 4am after a night of binge drinking... Oh, also it's nice to have people to talk to at the end of the day without having to make arrangements, plans, phone calls to meet, etc etc etc.
Just some thoughts from my one week of looking for housing in Hanoi.

Texas_blu · Joined: 26 Oct 2008 Posts: 108 Location: HCMC, VN

OK, that should have been written - A new "fresh off the boat" person makes most of the Saigon VN salivate. Generalities are never a good thing.

But hey inky what about this?

inky · Joined: 05 Jan 2009 Posts: 283 Location: Hanoi

Landlords charging $100 more to foreigners? Did you ever buy a used car in the US? Anyway, I said usually it's cents not dollars, meaning most general expenses, excluding housing. I wasn't clear about that. I get tired of people whining about the 'foreigner tax' as if it is some nationwide policy, when in fact it's often anecdotal (including the housing stories).

And I don't think it's a big 'if' to get hired by a good school. You just have to do some research and know what to look for.

Thank you for recognizing your overgeneralization.

ajc19810 · Joined: 22 May 2008 Posts: 214

There are few agencies that specialize in finding houses for foreigners. They are more expensive as they break down the language barrier between you and the landlord and the fact that the landlord thinks foreigners have cash (If only they knew the same broke ass teachers that i know). However, it would be nice if the service went for the duration of your stay e.g how to pay bills, hooking up cable tv and internet.

I'm actually finding less and less 'foreign tax' being applied. Nobody has to accept foreign tax. Don't like it don't take the deal the same goes for all general expenses. Foreign tax often amazingly dissapears when you walk away.

Does anybody make any donations to the boys in green?

jgmodlin · Joined: 01 Mar 2006 Posts: 120 Location: USA

Hmm... well having read Texas' post it sure doesn't make Vietnam look like a very pleasant option. I hardly think I would come across as some guy who "just fell of the turnip truck". I mean it's not like I am some kid who just graduated from college and is looking for his first big adventure abroad. Nevertheless, this scamming thing seems to be common thread throughout many of the postings here.

I guess at the end of the day perhaps Vietnam makes more sense as a place to visit and not necessarily live. I mean who wants to have their blood pressure elevated all the time while assuming that everyone is constantly trying to scam you.

Korea, I don't think I would want to do as everyone seems to have a horror story there, and the locals seem less than welcoming. It looks like a return to Japan or perhaps Taiwan would make more sense for us.

Thanks for all the posts and input...

merz · Joined: 07 Jan 2009 Posts: 5

I have only been here for 7 weeks, and am yet to buy a house so obviously I cant comment on that. Nonetheless, my experience so far suggests all this talk of scamming is fear-mongering nonsense.
YES, you may pay a bit more than the locals for some things, but its a socialist country (from each according to his ability, etc). Now I know many disagree with this way of thinking and I'm not suggesting you should walk down the street throwing Dong around like wedding confetti, but quite frankly considering the wage disparity i really dont mind being charged an extra 20% on something like Banh mi or a taxi.
Sometimes they do take the piss, but once you've been here a week or two you can spot it a mile off, and either haggle or go to the next guy 20 metres down the road selling the same thing.
Finally, this is more than off-set by the generosity of the more well off people who dont make a living from tourists. I have the advantage of travelling alone so maybe I get to meet more randomers, but on several occasions now I have been befriended by a bunch of engineers or office workers eager to practice their english. They have then taken it upon themselves to take me out to the bar/ juice place/ pool hall and not let me put my hand in my pocket all night, provided I babble at them a bit.

That is my personal experience of the Vietnamese, and I wont have them all labelled as scammers. Thank you.

inky · Joined: 05 Jan 2009 Posts: 283 Location: Hanoi

Very nice post, merz. My experience exactly (over a period of 10 years now).

Texas_blu · Joined: 26 Oct 2008 Posts: 108 Location: HCMC, VN

jgmodlin,

I hate to be "the guy" that talked you out of coming to Vietnam. My post was a little more articulate because of the baby. I tend to place young children at a higher level of importance than adults.

But as others have pointed out, NOT all VN's are scammers. The overwhelming majority of VN's are at the lower income level AND haggling is part of the culture. Of course, this is true of many cultures - ever been to Mexico? But once you move up to a little higher income level, the percentage of scammers is very small indeed. However, in our industry, that percentage climbs a bit.

Even my wife constantly complains about how the price suddenly increases once they figure out she's married to a foreigner. But aside from that, almost all of my good friends are VN and my trust in THESE VN's is complete. This is a culture of open-hearted people but there is 2 faces when comes to money BUT that might not apply to you.

Before you totally give up on this place, go to saigonesl.com and look at the school listings. Perhaps you could land a job and get accommodations before ever leaving the US, depending on your credentials.

If your salary is high enough, the dual pricing won't bother you too much.