Job Discussion Forums

[ebond007]

The long and short:

The wife and I are both 25, good health, no kids, currently living in Texas. We both have BAs (English and History, respectively). She has a teaching license, I do not, but do have about 3 years ESL experience working for my undergrad university. We've both studied traditional Wushu for about 6 years, as well. We've recently begun the search for a gig in China. We're not terribly picky, but would prefer someplace near the coast. Obviously, number-one concern is getting a quality/trustworthy employer.

I've read the stickies and searched as many FAQs as I can but still have a number of questions:

1. What are the best channels to go through for first-timers? I hear horror stories no matter who I talk to, so I'm not really sure where to start.

2. We'd really like to be somewhere in the northern or mid-coastal provinces (Shandong, Hebei, Liaoning, Jiangsu, Jilin, etc.). However, I hear these don't pay nearly as well. Is this pretty much an unavoidable truth?

3. We have some very modest savings, but nothing spectacular. What can we *realistically* expect to be putting away with this work? It seems like the conversion rates would really kill the chance to save much money.

4. This isn't meant to be a one-time adventure, for us. We're really hoping to move forward into a full career here in some capacity. Maybe not always teaching, but something in the Asian/international market. What kind of career paths can really be branched off from this? The idea of teaching for a year or so and then coming back to try to find an office job or something sounds maddening.

5. Please advise on any other "must-know" bits a new face might not think to ask.

Thanks!

[Zero]

The "must-know" is that very often a move to China kills a marriage. There are just too many women throwing themselves at the man. I think posts like this often get deleted by the mods, but I'm just telling it like it is, and in my opinion it needs to be said.
Chris Rock once said, "A man is as faithful as his options."

[sui jin]

I'd be inclined to take the previous post with a pinch of salt. Chinese students and women in general are very respectful to married men and don't 'throw themselves' at anyone, although I admit they can be very friendly and sometimes send out confusing signals (cultural differences etc).

I don't know about Wushu specifically, but I know of a very popular master of Taichi (tai ji) in Lianyungang to the north of Jiangsu. Many foreigners come to study with him. Lianyungang is near the coast (though the city proper is 45 mins by bus from the sea)

The local colleges usually have recruitment problems because the city is remote and frankly underdeveloped. Search on Google if you fancy it. I can vouch for one of the colleges as a good employer.

[ebond007]

Thanks very much to both of you for the honest and helpful replies.

Zero: I appreciate your candor and will take that under advisement. It comes as no surprise to me that Asian women can be quite alluring to Western men, and vice versa.

Sui Jin: Thank you for the advice. I, myself, have studied Taiji for quite a while and really enjoy it. I've been at it long enough to know to look for a good teacher, though. Too often, people have no interest in the fundamental (fighting) principles behind the arts and just want to look pretty. I'm not one of those people. You wouldn't happen to know the name of this teacher, would you? As for the city, I don't mind remote, but I don't want to feel isolated. I'd like to feel "immersed" in the culture. Can you be specific about which school you are vouching for so I can inquire further?

Thanks again!

[China.Pete]

As your spouse has a teaching license, OP, you would be well advised to limit your search to bona fide international schools (saving money being a consideration). You could try to get hired on at the same school as an ESL instructor by offering them a "two-fer." This might only pay around �10,000 a month, one-half or less what the "real" teacher can earn, but still not bad for China, where universities offer �4,000-6,000. While the downside of such schools can be loads of extra-curricular teaching duties and administrative overhead, they are not by and large among those that will miss payrolls or skimp on offering health insurance. You can try contacting the schools directly, but many also hire mainly through international job fairs or by using one of the educational service agencies such as ISS
( http://www.iss.edu/ ).

[ebond007]

Pete: Thanks for the input. Could you possibly advise on how to search for schools, job fairs, and placement agencies?

Also, anyone who could field some of my other, specific questions would be most appreciated.

Thanks!

[China.Pete]

"Could you possibly advise on how to search for schools, job fairs, and placement agencies?" -- E Bond

Go to Google.com. Type the terms in your list into the search box. Press enter. Then click on the hyperlinks to any of the search results which interest you. As for the last item, you need only click on the hyperlink contained in my previous post to be taken to the website of one of the largest such agencies in the United States.

"What can we realistically expect to be putting away with this work?" -- E Bond

Living expenses will obviously vary a lot from one person to the next, and two people living together can probably live more cheaply than two individually. But I'd say that �4,000-6,000 a month on average (or a typical university salary for one person) would probably not be an unreasonable amount to budget for your household.

"The idea of teaching for a year or so and then coming back to try to find an office job or something sounds maddening." -- E Bond

If you are intending to come to China as a teacher, looking for a career, then you'd probably better look upon teaching as your career goal. Career changes are challenging enough even in the fairly fluid U.S. job market; attempting it in a foreign country where you are an alien really can be maddening.

[Hansen]

Ebond, I've been doing wushu in China for the past ~5 years. Are you coming here to do wushu or to teach? If you could only do one, which would it be? Important question because it could help you in your search. Do you want to look for a teaching job in a place where there is good wushu, or find a good teaching job and do wushu on a casual basis?

I would be very careful of "masters." They may be martial artists but chances are extremely good that if you are a foreigner, they will also exhibit some slick moves as rip off artists.

Actual figures: Famous taiji "master" in this city charges Chinese ~2000RMB yearly for classes. Foreigners pay ~16,000RMB. Another branch of same school is ~2000RMB vs ~9000RMB. I recently heard of a guy who is paying ~10000RMB /monthly. He could probably be getting training suitable for his level for 10RMB/monthly in a park.

Wushu in China has turned into a big scam when foreigners are involved. You will pay nearly 10x the rate for admission to major competitions. The competitions, in the past, have given everyone a medal, regardless of the skill level. After the big world contests, you can go online and see schools bragging about winning 20 medals at the competition. They don't tell you that every participant got a medal.

I recently read about a guy that studied at the Shaolin temple in the early nineties and negotiated a price of ~$1100 a month. I had a friend from Germany that was paying several hundred a month to study Wudang near Wudang mountain.

Do you have nay idea how much money $1100 a month was in the early nineties in China? A fortune!

You can do much better in the parks around the area in which you will eventually live. The teachers I've had here are not too interested in money. They do taiji because they love it. Some of them are as good or better than those who will be teaching you in a "master's" school.

Now and then one of my teacher's teachers comes by and gives me a few pointers. Recently my teacher was studying with a guy who learned taiji two hands down from Chen Fa Ke. The word gets around in the parks about people who are seriously practicing. Good teachers "appear" when you are ready. Or you can just get out your check book. Actually not: Cash only. A year in advance. No refunds. 10x the ordinary rate.

For the most part, the English teaching game here is a joke. Taiji can be serious business, if you want it to be.

[Jayray]

Try ESLJOB.COM. Subscribe to their emails. You'll get a good idea of what is offered in China.

There are many other avenues, but I believe that this will direct you to a lot of possibilities.

Good luck to you.

[ebond007]

[naturegirl321]

[nickpellatt]

OP - are you on facebook?

There is a group on Facebook called 'The China Network' and this group has an active member in China (with his fiancee) who is quite into Wushu. I dont have contact details for him directly...but if you are on Facebook and you join this group...im sure a post about Wushu will attract some comments.

[Hansen]

If Wudang is your game, look around Wuhan or smaller cities in Hubei. Wushu/taiji is quite regional. Also, my remarks above pertained primarily to taiji. It is popular and done in the parks. Kung fu is done on a much more limited scale, primarily with children. At least in these parts of Henan, you would have difficulty finding quality kung fu in the parks.

Taiji is the main reason I stay here. My guess is that you will soon see the English language business for what it is, a means to an end, unless you happen to be a linguist or a dedicated professional language instructor.

I would definitely head to Hubei, if you really enjoy wushu. Nice to have something to think about while roasting in one of China's ovens.

[ebond007]