Job Discussion Forums

[scottydoesntknow]

Hi all,

I have been a lurker on here on and off since last summer. I would have liked to kick start my ESL life then, however, decided I had neither the financial resources nor enough time to make a informed decision that could possibly require making a year commitment.

The Vitals

As for now, I am 24 years old and have a B.A. in International Affairs from Florida State University. I have no teaching certs or experience, but I have an interview next monday for substitute teaching (trying to get any sort of teaching experience I can). I am interested in teaching in Asia starting in either August or Septmeber. Asia is the destination at this time mostly for the usual reasons (ability to save, flight, free accomadation, etc.). My preferences for countries would probably look like so: 1) Japan 2) China 3)Korea. I see teaching English abroad as an avenue for me to learn a language or two over the years and save some money to enroll in grad school afterwards. I am aware my job is to teach English and that I will be in contact with English most of the day, please just take my word that languages are something I do for fun, so I will put forth the effort to learn

My options as I see them

Japan

I'm pretty sure no matter how much I would like to make Japan my choice, it's most likely not doable this year. For one the main hiring season has passed and I have no TESOL cert or experience. I understand both are important in Japan as the job market is flooded and my qualifications are rather limited. Couple those with only having about 700 (US) saved I probably could not afford the start up costs. However, I am saving about 150 to 200 dollars a week currently. I have seen 2 year contracts offered, would they offer more incentive than a 1 year? Like flight, or paid accomdation?

China

I still as of yet have a concrete understanding of the Chinese market. From what I understand a degree is not mandatory, yet, I have seen jobs ask for a diploma and TESOL. It seems the requirements are going up. Flight and accomadation seem to be included in the many a jobs which makes China appealing. Pay seems to be all over the place. Am I wrong in noticing that university jobs pay less then most language school jobs? Oddities like these have my guard up about China. Also, the shear size of the country makes it hard to pinpoint where to even go.

Korea

Seems like the easiest and surest bet for me to secure a job. I really wouldn't have much in terms of start up costs, just would have to support myself until the first pay check. Some of the hagwon stories I have read scare me, so I would probably feel better making a commitment to a public school.

Finally

Am I remotely correct in assessing my situation? I hope my time reading these forums have not been wasted. I know that ultimately the decision is up to me, I just would like some advice from those with experience and more knowledge then myself. My apologies if this post is neither concise nor clear. Thank you for your time.


Cheers,


Scott


P.S.

I would really like to enroll in a TESOL cert. program before teaching, but think my funds will hinder me. Anyone know of any programs or schools that will provide the cert program and guarantee you a job afterwards? The only one I have seen is the American TESOL Thailand/Korea Program http://www.americantesolinstitute.com/esljobs_korea.shtml : 3 weeks in Thailand then one year contract to teach in Korea. I'm worried about the flight that is included; sounds sketchy.[/url]

[Jati]

You are in the same age range as my children (20-25) so I will give you the same advice that I would give them.

Keep your current job at least through this year (2009), and maybe even next year , and save up that $150-200 per week. There is growing unemployment everywhere including those countries that you are considering. I live in Malaysia and can say that the economies of SE Asia are shrinking a bit after decades of 6-10% annual growth.

You really do need an English teaching qualification to get considered in the higher-paying countries (the ones that you chose). Look for the Cambridge U./International House Cert. in Teaching English as a Foreign Language to Adults (CTEFLA). This is a 4-week, 120-hour, program that is recognised worldwide. Mine cost only $1500 back in 1995, and I doubt that the price has gone much over $2000 since then. Most large cities in the USA have this course, and you could do it on a one-month leave of absence from work.

After obtaining a qualification, such as the CTEFLA, and spending some more time doing research (as you doing), then you should be able to find some overseas teaching stint around mid-2010 to early 2011. I know that at 24, that seems like a long time away, but it isn't. Money is the key here, and you have little. Your B.S. degree alone won't get you much overseas, and as you are able to save money now from your current job, then stick with it until the economies over here begin to improve. Actually, the USA will probably recover before the Asian economies do.

Now I know that a hundred people your age, or slightly older, will also respond to this thread and tell you to "Go for it! Don't listen to an old guy." Well, we old people have seen a few crash-and-burns in our lifetimes and that is why we give such advice to the young.

[scottydoesntknow]

Jati,

Don't father me! J/k. Honestly, thanks for the experienced advice. I will certainly take what you say into account. Nothing would be worse than to make the jump then be forced back home due to unemployment.

When it comes to age, if I go at 24 or 25 is of no consequence to me. I think being more prepared financially would make the move much more easy on myself. I fret about money enough in my home country, I doubt it goes better abroad.

Without being able to put away more money than I am now, mid-2010 would probably work. That will definitely give me adequate time to determine my ideal destination.

Jati, you say your in Malayasia. How is the ESL life there?

[roadwalker]

Hi, I can only tell you about door number 2, China. I've only worked at universities and wouldn't change at this point. Yes the pay is often lower than at the language schools. The upside is that your holidays follow the academic year, so you will have a minimum of six or seven weeks of paid vacation in total. Also your hours would be about a third fewer than a comparable language school and the hours would more likely be day time m-f hours. Or m-th etc. It wouldn't be hard to find private students to supplement your income, and you'll have the time.

On the other hand, the universities require a bachelors degree, a tefl/Celta/Tesol certificate and two years experience. Now, some schools can't seem to find qualified teachers and are ready to bend the rules, but those are the official minimums. A good school will set you up nicely in a comfortable apartment (no share) and basically baby you until you get on you get accustomed to living there, and probably much longer. One negative trend (it's not all roses) is on the return airfare: I've noticed more and more schools putting caps on the reimbursement. That is something to bargain for, or if not possible, to figure into the overall compensation equation.

You can definitely save in China, but it will come at the expense of partying, comfort food, traveling and whatever vices you may have. Saving for another year isn't bad advice, and you can get some experience with part time work or volunteering. Expect to pay for your airfare and visa (130 USD and negotiable who pays) up front as well as incidental expenses and food for the first month. (Airfare is typically refunded at the end of contract but many pay in halves or monthly, some right away but don't expect that for your first job without great credentials.)

Do not go overseas to even a well researched job with your last dollar! Stuff happens and you will need cash or credit if it does. Have at least airfare back home at your disposal. Good luck whichever way you go.

[parrothead]

Jati is a good voice of reason on these boards, and he makes some wise points about saving up a nest egg and getting sorted before you jump into teaching esl/efl abroad.

I live in Japan, and am not sure what you mean about the hiring season having passed. If you take a look at www.gaijinpot.com or right here on Dave's you'll notice that a lot of schools are hiring. If you are flexible about the city you want to live in, you stand a reasonable chance of finding a job. I've also learned that entry-level teaching jobs rarely require certification. Training, extra schooling and certification are helpful, but for eikaiwa positions it's not usually necessary. A lot of people get their foot in the door this way, and then decide if teaching English is something they want to do long-term. And then they go for extra qualifications. Of course I would recommend any kind of training or certification beforehand, as you would feel more confident and prepared.
I wouldn't move to Japan with only 700USD. Some schools help find apartments or cover some start up costs, but depending on when you start working it could be a month and a half before your first paycheck. Japan is a hell of a place to be penniless.
From what I've seen and read Korea is definitely the easiest country to get started in. Browse through the Korean forum and you'll learn a lot.

Good luck, Scott, with whatever you decide.

[Jati]