Job Discussion Forums

[SueH]

Thank you, PattyFlipper.. it's nice to know that one isn't alone in the 'buggermeIcantbelieveit' stakes.

I recall I've asked before: "who takes these jobs?". Have they no shame, are they that desperate, are they that badly qualified??? "There goes the blackleg teacher.."

I think I'm increasing my hours in the local state schools next academic year, so I might just try for a very cheap summer with the odd private lesson to help on the fun front..

It's a bugger, I used to do me own basic plumbing and electrics, but now you need various certificates to sign things off. I've known the odd plumber/leccy do a little half hour cash job for a tenner, or so me ageing Mum tells me, but those rates, for a few intermittent hours, with hours of prep..?? Minchia!!

[PattyFlipper]

[Kipling]

Well the CELTA does give you an introduction into teaching, but the real introduction is actually teaching for many people, and I know some very good teachers whose experience has been of greater value than their qualifications and I know some well qualified teachers who...are... well just not so good in the classroom, but who do you think will be preferred in many jobs in the long run? Experience plus quals seems essential to get any job with half way decent remuneration and anyway who becomes a TEFL teacher for the pay???? Many initially see the CELTA as a way of paying their way while travelling around the world, again nothing wrong in that, shows good initiative. You are right that a lot of TEFLERS spend their lives abroad, the longer away the longer you stay away, many cannot return to decent jobs or salaries,point taken about the summer pressessionals and University work. as rare as rocking horse droppings for some.
There is a discussion on another board and a little bit of argy bargy between language schools and FE's and IMHO some sort of very English subtle take on the class system...us them...different....better.All rather depressing.
Those that make a career in TEFL often do it for the love of teaching and want get or be better at what they do and if that means the DELTA or MA then it is worth their while both financially and professionaly.
I am doing a distance MA TESOL with Oxford Brookes, self paid, self development. I will finish oh......just about when I retire. Is it worth it?
Of course, because it puts all the years of experience into perspective and I have learned a lot and think I have developed as a teacher.
By the way in TEFL
"Disappointment is all the rage./ For Teachers of a certain age."

Cheers Mr K

[Phil_b]

The discussion about FE and language schools is here:

http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=68287&start=15

The relevant point that comes from that discussion is that due to either the better language schools, or colleges, or universities, there is no need to accept rates like those offered by the schools highlighted in this thread... University jobs might be rare, but there's plenty of work around in colleges - as a guide, check the TES http://www.tes.co.uk/jobsSearchResults.aspx?keywords=ESOL and there's plenty of hourly-paid, agency work that doesn't show up there.

I think there is a need for some kind of association/union... if just to remind people what they don't need to accept and to give them the confidence to turn it down.

[Kipling]

Couldn't agree more, Phil_b, but that would involve standards across the board for both TEFL teachers and education establishments.
Mr K

[SueH]

Just a comment on Phil's job link: the part time jobs, of which there can be quite a few at FE colleges, are often only advertised in local newspapers, as nobody is going to move nationally for 6 hours a week or so.

That was my experience in the UK a few years ago and I doubt it's changed much.

[Phil_b]

I'd second Sue's comment - most jobs, especially entry level ones are never advertised - just pick up the phone and call is probably the best tactic...

A few more jobs here

http://www.talent.ac.uk/jobs_results.asp?Keywords=esol&submit=Search&Subjects=&RegionID=&Frequency=%25&browse=1

[SueH]

... or possibly advertised on the colleges' own web-sites... so target colleges in the areas in which you are interested.

[coledavis]

Experienced teachers can get 11 pounds an hour (teaching contact time) at the Edwards (Ealing, west London) and probably other suburban schools. Some central London schools pay more. If you are a newbie, you may have to settle for the 9 pounds an hour for a few months and then apply to somewhere better.

[BrownSauce]

Eleven quid an hour is still peanuts, though - I was earning more in London TEN YEARS AGO! Even the worst-paying college (I was working at three) were paying me 12.50!

So, if you get paid 11 quid for five or six contact hours per day, that makes around ... 300 quid a week?! Which is about the same as you can get working on the checkout at your local supermarket.

I rest my case...

[coledavis]

ho-hum - yes I know TEFL pay is rubbish. It's just that I read the stuff about 9 quid an hour and just decided to let you know what is going. Yes, it isn't getting any better, what with the recession 'n all. Merely complaining about peanuts isn't going to help, is it?

[smallish]

Yes maybe its true that it only requires sentience to get an EFL job in some places. And maybe that psychologically pushes all of us who're qualified into accepting low-paid work. But it shouldn't.

In markets where they're demanding real qualifications, real experience and real teachers, we shouldn't accept the rotten pay. London is a great example: most schools seem to be advertising an hourly salary that doesn't even attain London-weighted poverty levels. OUCH. But they want so much. And the jobs doing EAP w/unis? DELTA-qualified for 13/hour?

So yes, in general the pay certainly IS peanuts. 'Cos we have to have jobs and we don't seem to be left with too much leverage. As a new-ish EFL teacher with an I.T. career previously, I've spent a few raging moments this first teaching abroad year, coming to grips with being part of the financial trash heap for the rest of my life. I realised quite soon that this malarkey is never going to be even a break-even game. In fact, I've "donated" rather than profited at the end of the year. At least, I'm benefitting the local economy!

Going abroad, setting up house, in some places paying the premium "foreigner rates" -- even without debts back home, I've watched my very small savings dwindling to even smaller.

Alternatives? Well, if you are keen to help raise the next generations, I've realised that nannies/childminders are rewarded very well indeed. Private child-minding, with a bit of teaching thrown in, looks a very interesting alternative that seems to actually pay a rate where a person can save a little bit. You might get food and shelter thrown in on top of pay AND some foreign travel. Check it out.

As a member of a trade union and a believer in the animal: I can't believe its true that there isn't an EFL trade union? Not even one that an E.U. citizen can join? Hmm wonder what the logistics of this might be to set up??

[SueH]

Smallish - ex-commerce and IT here too, which I left due to terminal boredom. Fortunately a (small) pension kicked in which probably allows me my sod �10 (or �) an hour attitude. But you are right about spending money to set up abroad...

Newly qualified on the South Coast I was getting �12 an hour in 2002/3 and �20+ at an FE college, so the London rates have no excuse.

[TheLongWayHome]

[TheLongWayHome]