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Unmarried and living together ?
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frogandeagle



Joined: 29 May 2009
Posts: 15
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

inky wrote:
This ONLY applies to foreigners wanting to room with Vietnamese nationals.


Thanks for clearing that up Inky - neither of us are Vietnamese so that makes me feel a lot better about it. Feel sorry for those who want to date a Vietnamese woman though...
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saigon cowboy



Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 84

PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes frog, she's vietnamese. I don't know if this helps or hurts the situation.
With two foreigners living together the police might harass them more than if one of them were vietnamese due to the fact they can extort more money from two foreigners.

Pleading ignorance of the law is an option, but you still might have to pay a fine.

It also depends on your neighborhood. Vuon Chuoi ( banana garden )neighborhood in district 3 is more strict.

Nearby Soviet neighborhood is not as strict, but still try to keep a low profile. No open displays of affection etc.

It's just not socially acceptable to most vietnamese for unmarried people to live together regardless of what the law says.
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Texas_blu



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 108
Location: HCMC, VN

PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a post I put in the thread "forgandeagle" started

Quote:
But my police friends tell me that it's still enforced predominately on foreigners and a few VN's as a "morality" issue. This means that your neighbors can make trouble for you and the police might back them up. Morality is a very gray area and in a communal society the majority will decide predominately. This is the same way that Hotels can ask for a marriage certificate and refuse you a room.

So, it is still illegal IF enough people or a business owner still wants it to be. This is fairly common here to have over-lapping laws. Welcome to Vietnam!


This is something I've personally witnessed. A Korean man and a VN woman signed a 1 year lease just 2 doors down from my place in D. 7. We had become friends because his English was pretty good although quite rough.

My wife had heard rumors that most of the neighbors were upset that their children had to witness this immoral behavior and they started a petition. About a week later, the police showed up around 10:30pm and asked for their marriage certificate. Of course they didn't have one and I think it was quite redundant because the landlord had to have registered that way as is required for every household.

She packed up some stuff and went to stay with some friends immediately. Later, they were told that they could stay there BUT that she wouldn't be able to sleep there at night. If they caught her sleeping there again, the lease would be revoked. The landlord was apologetic but asked them to leave. They did and moved to Phu My Hung where the police and the neighbors were more liberal.

I've also seen and heard of people having to rent 2 Hotel rooms.
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saigon cowboy



Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 84

PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phu My Hung is too expensive for english teachers, but it would be an ideal place otherwise.

So, the burden is on those who choose to break the moral standards of vietnam.
Yes you can live together , but be prepared for police scrutiny and possibly moving again and again.

In my opinion it's no advantage if you are both foreigners.

In fact I think the advantage is having a vietnamese girlfriend who is well spoken, respectable, and who can talk on your behalf.
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Texas_blu



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 108
Location: HCMC, VN

PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
In my opinion it's no advantage if you are both foreigners.


In my opinion, it is. As it has been explained to me, most VN's believe that the foreigner doesn't understand how to behave in a "civilized society". Of course, this is a prejudiced point of view but most countries and the people living in them seem to think "their way" is always the best and most appropriate way.

So I think that the neighbors might be more tolerating as they could tell their children that the foreigners just don't know how to behave, but with one of them being VN - the children wouldn't believe that especially if they're teenagers. Of course, this is only my opinion from living more than 4 years and being married to a VN.
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saigon cowboy



Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 84

PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well what do you do.....show your marriage license to every nosey neighbor on your street ?

I tell the neighbors nothing and the police the truth.


Last edited by saigon cowboy on Thu Jun 18, 2009 12:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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mach114



Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 56

PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually if you have a proper marriage license, you show it to the police when you register for your new house or give them a photocopy. They will leave you alone guaranteed. They never bothered my wife and I for more than three years while I lived in Vietnam at various locations.

Also, you should consider learning Vietnamese so you can understand what she is talking about and the police for that matter. Your married already, she knows this? So what does she want from you? All questions I hope you have asked yourself. You seem like you are in Vietnam for the long term and trying to make the best of it, so I suggest you invest sometime in the language and be independent from your girlfriend. Besides, if you can talk to the neighbors they are more likely to be accepting of you and you might actually make some good friends. Just some healthy advice from a concerned Dave's blogger.
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sigmoid



Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 1276

PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone who doubts how prudish the Vietnamese can be, read this:

http://www.straitstimes.com/Breaking+News/SE+Asia/Story/STIStory_392961.html

Cover underwear mannequins

HANOI - SHOP mannequins displaying underwear will have to take cover under a regulation passed by authorities in Vietnam's commercial capital.

The models must no longer be visible from shop fronts under the rule controlling various forms of advertising in southern Ho Chi Minh City, formerly Saigon, the Phap Luat Ho Chi Minh City newspaper said on its website.

'Putting the mannequin somewhere that people in the streets cannot see it is OK,' the report quoted local official Le Quang Vinh as saying.

'No one wears underwear in public places, and it runs counter to Vietnamese traditional custom.'

Underwear mannequins are widespread at shops in Ho Chi Minh City and elsewhere in Vietnam. -- AFP
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saigon cowboy



Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 84

PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dang.... no more cruising around and looking at shop window underwear mannequins. Rolling Eyes
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mach114



Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 56

PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
'No one wears underwear in public places, and it runs counter to Vietnamese traditional custom.'


Actually they do......... but they wear pants or dresses over them, I hope!
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Cat Attack



Joined: 29 Apr 2008
Posts: 16
Location: Hanoi, Vietnam

PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've lived with my boyfriend in Hanoi (4 months) and Da Nang (5 months) and we've had no issues. Especially being in Danang, we are the only foreigners in teh street, everyone knows we are not married.
Had no problems at all.
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Texas_blu



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 108
Location: HCMC, VN

PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Overlapping laws and situations that aren't clearly defined are fairly normal here in VN. Here's an article in the Thanh Nien Newspaper that writes about this. Although it's primarily about business, this is also true about civil laws.
here's the link...

http://www.thanhniennews.com/commentaries/?catid=11&newsid=50420
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