Job Discussion Forums

[zartic]

Hey everyone.

I would appreciate very much if you guys could take a look at these two job offers I received from China.

The first offer is located in Dongying City, Shandong province. The recruiter provided me with this website as well: http://www.shane.com.cn/index_dy.asp

The second offer is located in Taiyuan City, Shanghai province. The recruiter has asked just recently if I wish to accept the offer.

I have uploaded the first jobs contract (called First): http://www.docstoc.com/docs/8129446/First-(Revised)

Here is the other upload for the second offer (called Second):
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/8129450/Second-(Revised)

Well everyone what do you think of these two positions? Thanks in advance everyone.

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

You want a veteran's opinion? Here it is:

The Shane contract, you can just print up and put at the side of your toilet when you are running out of toilet paper.

They are charging you a montly "accomodation charge" but they don't say how much.

Also, I used to live in Dongying. Shane had teachers there making 9000+ RMB a month so... it they are giving you only 7200 RMB and taxing you AND taking an ambiguous amount of money off for accomodations (something most other schools do not do), you are getting jipped.

The other contract, I haven't seen so I can't comment.

[frank d]

Sorry, zartic, I'm unwilling to register with, and sign your guestbook in order to review the contracts -- and I assume many others will feel the same. From looking at the URLs though, it seems the Shandong position is with Shane English, yes?

Although people will always tell you that every franchise is different, basically Shane's reputation leaves much to be desired, especially the Dalian franchise of late. I'd say be careful hooking up with Shane. I also believe they primarily serve kindergarten-age students. If I am correct, and you are willing to teach kindergarten, then you have LOTS of options available to you.

There's a fair amount of posts regarding Shane on various ESL discussion websites/forums.

Again, that's the best I can advise at this point due to the registration barrier between me and the contracts.

[zartic]

Is there any chance you take a look at the other contracts frank d? I have placed them under a public domain. My email address in [email protected] if you wish to contact me personally. Thanks again.

[naturegirl321]

About the work hours, ask if you have office hours as well, or if you can just leave after class. Ask about extra hours, like English corners. But it seeems decent.

[Hansen]

zartic, While the contract may sound nice, it is more or less meaningless to your employers. It is just a tool to bamboozle foreigners into working in China on subsistence wages so your employers can get rich. Whatever the contract says, there is no certainty that it will be fulfilled. It's crucial that you speak with other FTs that have been there.

Agree to something like this:

16 fifty minute periods a week for_______RMB.

Round trip plane fare. Better is cash equivalent whether you go home or not.

Summer holiday 2 months, winter holiday ~1 month. The holiday should be salaried or have a bonus check incorporated into it.

Private living quarters in a satisfactory place. By satisfactory, I mean a place in which you can sleep without interruption, cook, shower, and stay warm or cool in the appropriate season.

Paid utilities.

Access to international calling without expensive deposit. This is usually in the form of ability to use phone cards.

Make sure that you can have ADSL internet. You may have to pay for this yourself, but it a point of negotiation. ~ 800RMB/yearly.

Good luck. Don't be to eager to sign a contract. Good way to get burned.

[The Ever-changing Cleric]

[nickpellatt]

The fact that Shane havent mentioned how much the charge for accom is would be a little worrying ... I would definately clarify that with them. And as another post mentions, the best thing you can do is ask to contact an FT who is currently working at the same school ... their opinion is the one you should listen to the most.

A final thing, and I may get flamed for saying this, but at some stage, you just have to take a leap of faith. I often read advice on the board about demanding this wage, or XYZ in paid holidays. Yeah, there may be some jobs that pay those wages, offer long holidays, and pay return airfares, but some dont. Id even say many dont. This doesnt have to mean they are terrible jobs and you should hold on for all the terms you want. Other factors are also important, and if there is a certain place you want to work, you may just have to accept the terms they offer to work there. I was in Hainan for almost 2 years, and I never met anyone who enjoyed a high salary, and low hours, luxury apartment and round trip airfare, but I did meet a number of teachers who had jobs they really liked and re-signed for longer terms.

Of course, asking for advice is fine, advisable even to avoid any real horror stories .... but at some stage you have to take that leap of faith, or you may find yourself sitting at home for years finding this great job that may not even exist.

I dont think anyone here would have given the thumbs up to my first job in China had I posted all the details here .... yet all the teachers I worked with at the school had re-signed contracts, and had been there for a number of years...and I enjoyed it there.

Likewise, I dont think anyone would agree with my second job in China either, which I start later this year. But I know someone who has worked there and Im prepared to make that decision based on factors other than the package.

Like I say, I dont expect everyone to agree with me ....

[Hansen]

Nick, I agree with what you say. A "leap of faith" is required. Especially in view of the fact that whatever the contract may say could simply be lies.

Zartic, Be sure to have enough extra money available to leave quickly or sustain you for a few months.

A good job in a pleasant place is worth a lot. While some of the suggestions in my previous post may be difficult for a newcomer now, I had nearly all of them when I first arrived, several years ago. I suggest that you avoid fraud and deception regarding the airline ticket, or any other matter. Some FTs here are unscrupulous themselves, so they don't mind repaying Chinese employers in their own coin.

I got burned on airline tickets, return fares, and so forth. Now I have no reimbursement, simply a higher salary and bonus unrelated to my travel. Mr Cleric is probably correct about negotiating that for a newcomer, but you can try.

Utilities can be a dark hole, especially if you spend the winter or summer here. I had a electric bill of nearly 4000RMB one winter. Admittedly, the circumstances were not ideal, but that gives you an idea of the type of costs you can run up.

Contracts with a large appendix containing various puzzling restrictions, I would also avoid. Bad sign when schools want to micromanage every detail of your life, even when you are not working for them.

I've seen contracts which leave open a possibility that an FT might work as many as ~22-24 periods a week. Usually it is downplayed by the person you talk to. Don't believe them. If you have any self respect, hold out for a suitable contract. You might even consider a high school or vocational school.

[JGC458]

OP, lots of good advice has been given.

[The Ever-changing Cleric]