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wanna_teach
Joined: 08 Jul 2009
Posts: 36
Location: Canada
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 Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 12:30 pm Post subject: Bell/KSU info pleeez! |
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I know this has been done to death, but I really need some info on Bell/KSU
I am considering a position with Bell at KSU and have read the threads about bell. I realize that probably only desperate ppl work there, but I am desperate. I don�t have an MA, so unless I want to teach kids in Asia (and earn decent money), this is pretty much my only option..
I am a female and was wondering if anyone who�s worked there had any insight/advice?
I have read that they keep your passport, is this true?
Is the housing as bad as I have read? Any chance of improvement for September? How many ppl share an apartment?
What happens if I really hate it there, would I be able to resign? Or would I have to just leave? Would I be able to just leave? This is my main concern if what I have read about housing and other conditions (no air conditioning, internet, gyms etc) are true.
It also seems that they intimidate and threaten teachers with being fired? Does anyone know of anyone getting fired? If you are fired, do you receive all the pay that you are owed?
I know this is not one of the best places to teach, but I really need some eperience witha adults.
Any info would be greatly appreciated |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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I think that this thread sums it all up.  http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?p=773702#773702
Now, I'll leave you to continue banging your head against the wall...nothing seems to get thru. I'd ask a question based on your hair color and a stereotype...but am afraid of your answer, so I won't.
NCTBA  |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Really... seriously... how many times do you want people to type the same information. Yes, they keep your passport and they can stop you from leaving. IMHO, I would believe what you read on this one and stay away. There are adults in other countries that can be taught.
Check the Oman board. There are recruiters hiring for the Ministry to teach at the small colleges. If you have a BA + an acceptable TEFL cert, you might be able to get a job there. The money will be less, but the conditions will be better... nice students... tolerable single housing (no sharing with gawdknowshoworwhat) ... poor to middling management.
And... if it isn't tolerable, you are not a "prisoner" with no passport or exit visa.
VS |
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Citizenkane
Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Posts: 234
Location: Xanadu
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| Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Veiled is right - there have been numerous threads on KSU already in which most or all of your questions have already been answered at least once.
For what it's worth, I'll repeat what I've always said about KSU (men's side): You hear a lot of negative things about it, but those of us who've done their time in KSA accept that it's not all that bad by local standards. What exactly 'not all that bad' means is subjective, but as I say you questions hae already been answered many times. |
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Mia Xanthi
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 955
Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?
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| Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:26 pm Post subject: |
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Citizenkane is right....you have to go through the threads and figure out which information is common to all jobs in KSA and which is specific to KSU. For example, ANY institution in KSA can prevent you from leaving. Whether or not they do depends on your specific contract and just how angry you make them by trying to leave. ANY employer can hold you hostage if your contract states that you must pay a penalty for leaving early.
The thing is that we assume that employers will be nice and see the human side of things if, for example, you have to leave early due to an illness in the family. In KSA, this is not usually the case. I've never seen employers with so little human compassion. If you even THINK that you might have to leave early due to illness or a family emergency, please investigate your employer very well....or be prepared to run for the border in the middle of the night without telling anyone where you are going. |
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Citizenkane
Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Posts: 234
Location: Xanadu
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| The thing is that we assume that employers will be nice and see the human side of things if, for example, you have to leave early due to an illness in the family. In KSA, this is not usually the case. |
In fairness, Mia, I'm not sure you can say this is 'not usually the case'.
I've done my time in KSA, and I have to say I've never known an employer to be less than cooperative and helpful in cases of emergency family leave. Maybe I've just been lucky, but as I say, in my years here I've amassed a fair amount of experience with employers. So I think your experience might be one of those best slotted under 'particular to this institution' rather than 'general to KSA'.
At least, I hope so. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:51 pm Post subject: |
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Based on my readings here over the years, the good/bad ratio of employers seems to be about 50/50?
VS |
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wanna_teach
Joined: 08 Jul 2009
Posts: 36
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks everyone for your info.
Sorry about the redundancy�. The money makes it sooo tempting to go there and I guess I was hoping that the answer would be different this time. 
I have scheduled an interview for next week, so I might as well see what they say.
Just so I understand, if I really wanted to leave and they refuse to return my passport, there�s nothing I can do, I�m just a hostage. Can I get my embassy involved? I also have an EU passport, would it be possible to use that to leave?
Veiled, thanks for your advice. Nothing on this website, but I found a posting on another website with CFBT educational trust, I checked the forum and there are a lot of negative posts about them. They sound almost identical to bell. I will apply anyways and see what happens.
Does anyone happen to have any other ideas of where to look for jobs teaching adults? I have a TEFL certificate from a college in Toronto and about 6 months experience in Spain. Many of the good jobs require a couple of years experience.
Thanks
Josie |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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Having your passport is not enough., If you want to leave you need an exit visa. This is provided by the Ministry of the Interior - when your employer asks for it.
Good employers will organise a multiple exit/re-entry visa and let you keep your passport. That means you are free to leave when you want.
Last edited by scot47 on Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| wanna_teach wrote: |
| Veiled, thanks for your advice. Nothing on this website, but I found a posting on another website with CFBT educational trust, I checked the forum and there are a lot of negative posts about them. They sound almost identical to bell. I will apply anyways and see what happens. |
There are a good half dozen recruiters in Oman and they seem to be hiring year around. This is a foot in the door/get something on the CV kind of job. To me the key difference is that in Oman, you can easily leave... no exit visa required... no passports held. The Oman branch is full of their names and their negatives.
You need to get some experience on that CV in order to get to the better jobs and employers.
And in Saudi... good luck on getting any help from your Embassy. I know the US embassy would just ignore you... you took the job... you knew the problems... too bad...
VS |
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Mia Xanthi
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 955
Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?
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| Posted: Sat Jul 11, 2009 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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| I've done my time in KSA, and I have to say I've never known an employer to be less than cooperative and helpful in cases of emergency family leave. Maybe I've just been lucky, but as I say, in my years here I've amassed a fair amount of experience with employers. So I think your experience might be one of those best slotted under 'particular to this institution' rather than 'general to KSA'. |
It might be that it is "general to WOMEN working in KSA". Where I worked. a wpman who had a family emergency had a snowball's chance in hell of getting out. The government relations department (responsible for issuing visas) would simply refuse to pick up the phone when you called, and as a woman you coulc not get into the men's campus where all the people who make decisions are. Seemed they only paid attention if a female supervisor needed emergency leave. Every other fenale was ignored. |
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Citizenkane
Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Posts: 234
Location: Xanadu
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:17 am Post subject: |
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It might be that it is "general to WOMEN working in KSA". Where I worked. a wpman who had a family emergency had a snowball's chance in hell of getting out. |
Again though Mia, you're basing this on one place (I believe you've only worked in one job in KSA?) Some of the colleges I've worked in had women's sections and I've never known a woman to have any more of a problem getting out than men (which is to say, no problem). I've also known plenty of women teacher, and while they compalin about a lot, this isn't an issue I've heard about. So I still hope and believe your experience is not a general one.
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| Based on my readings here over the years, the good/bad ratio of employers seems to be about 50/50? |
Veiled I don't think you can make a clear cut distinction between good and bad employers - not in KSA, not anywhere. It's a relative thing. Some employers are good in some ways but terrible in others - as I say, it's not that different to other parts of the world.
| Quote: |
| Can I get my embassy involved? I also have an EU passport, would it be possible to use that to leave? |
Embassies very occasionally are able to help out in these situations, but you certainly can't rely on it. Your EU passport is no good as you need an exit visa approved by your employers and it has to be with the same passport you entered the country on. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Citizenkane wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Based on my readings here over the years, the good/bad ratio of employers seems to be about 50/50? |
Veiled I don't think you can make a clear cut distinction between good and bad employers - not in KSA, not anywhere. It's a relative thing. Some employers are good in some ways but terrible in others - as I say, it's not that different to other parts of the world. |
I didn't feel like typing the obvious. I define a "good employer" as one where the good exceeds the bad... and a "bad employer" as the opposite.
And I do think that for a majority of employers one can make a very clear cut decision one way or the other. It is the employers in the middle that are the most difficult to decide or help someone decide to take the job. 
VS |
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Citizenkane
Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Posts: 234
Location: Xanadu
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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| It is the employers in the middle that are the most difficult to decide or help someone decide to take the job. |
I would say 'the employers in the middle' make up about 90% of the total.
Really, there are very few 'avoid like the plague' employers, and there are even fewer 'dream employers'. The vast majority are somewhere in between. Also, what's 'good' for one person may not be so good for another. Some places are good for single people but not families and vice versa. Some people are pretty good at being able to shut out unpleasant work environments, while others get really stressed. Some people are prepared to take less money if they work in a decent environment with plenty of time off, but others don't mind living in some hell hole if they can save big money quick. And so on.
Also, remember places change. I know people who left otherwise good jobs because they couldn't stand the supervisor. Then, the supervisor left about 2 months later, and they were stuck in a less well paying job with little chance of going back to the job they walked out of recently.
I think the phrase' everything is relative' really really applies to this part of the world.
[/code] |
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tefl2010
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Posts: 19
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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| In Saudi Arabia you need an Exit Visa, you cannot just leave if you do not like your workplace. |
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