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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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 Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:16 am Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| Glenski, if one already could answer this there would really be no need to go teach abroad anyways. Ok, some people may move to X country because they think it is better than where they currently live. But a large percentage of people go to teach in a new country because they want to experience it. If they knew what it was like then why would they go there? |
I think you have it confused. I merely wanted the OP to say what he felt he knew about Asian culture now so we would know where he was coming from, and to think about what to say to an interviewer when he also asked. Different answers, because the employer would want to know if the guy was an anime freak or had a J girlfriend or some other negative point.
I can't imagine how they feel when interviewees say things like...
"Oh, I just LOVE the J culture. Uh, no, I've never actually BEEN there, but I've READ about it a lot!"
Now this comment (below) is a bit stronger, as there are actual examples (and manga/anime are not mentioned):
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| It began with courses in Chinese and Japanese art, and evolved as I felt I was becoming a Buddhist and then a Taoist. From there I've soaked up all the Travel Channel and Discovery/Science channel programs I could. |
Not that becoming Buddhist or Taoist is any cinch to landing a job...
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| If a person feels the need to connect with the organism known as the planet there is not a better, or older, place to attempt it than in China. If one is tired of the city life, China has country side and mountains where one can find a simpler life. |
Those things are in Japan, too.
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| Maybe youre thinking touring IS a better idea for me, but one does have to think practically about visas and financial concerns - and teaching is a means to an end, but it's also something I want to do in and of itself. |
Then get some touring under your belt, get further educated for teaching, and do it then. There will be time for vacations and other stuff while you teach, but it sounds like you have more of a travel bug to sate first.
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| It's about being on the front lines of technology in Japan and the novelty of buying a cell phone from a vending machine. I love asian cuisine and women. |
Japan copies a lot of technology, don't you know? Vending machine novelty interests simply show employers how easy you are to please and that you are not thinking about the job. BIG negative point.
Do NOT mention the women, past, present or future!
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| It's about mountains and oceans and men in bamboo boats, fishing with birds. |
Very romantic, but lots of fishermen use modern boats these days.
If you apply to the JET programme, you'll probably be considered for rural positions far more than urban ones. Idyllic visions are one thing, and I'm not trying to discourage you here, but have you thought about what it would actually be like to be the only foreigner (lonely) in a small town (zero English everywhere) far from comforts (even simple ones) of bigger cities? You would also be the scrutiny of the whole population by sheer virtue of who you are, but you would not be as close to anyone as you like/expect. Check out www.bigdaikon.com for firsthand info from JET programme ALTs and CIRs.
| JZer wrote: |
| Furthermore, is there any research or anything that would show that an employee needs to have a goal or reason to be a good employee. |
Research? Well, how about asking HR personnel everywhere? Many/Most will tell you that to get a job, you should show an interest and some knowledge of the company (let alone country). As for EFL teachers, many employers are leery of the geeks and perverts and louses who just want to come and explore hedonistic ways instead of doing the job they are being hired for. Employers have paying customers that they hope to remain or attract, and showing that you have something to offer or at least some knowledge of what is involved goes a long way.
| dirimini wrote: |
| Finally, why do you think you can get a degree "on the cheap," "overseas"? Every graduate degree program I've ever seen has had one set of tuition/fees for natives, and another (much higher) for non-natives. Please (anyone) correct me if I'm wrong about this. |
I agree with you. Adam may have found some cheap/free programs, but are they accepted or worth the paper they are printed on?
Distance learning is not only expensive, but people ignore the fact that there are deadlines to meet, so it's not all a piece of cake. Studying, working, getting used to a new job, daily life, getting used to new surroundings & culture, meeting new people, trying to learn the local language -- these are all part of a newbie's life, and it's overwhelming to many.
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| My CV is quite strong. |
Without seeing it in detail here, could you explain it? I assume you mean strong towards your field, not towards teaching, which is what we are trying to advise you about!
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| The only real cost one needs to worry about in France is what it costs to live. Arguably, a part time job would be necessary. |
I thought Americans couldn't get work permits for that part of Europe...? |
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AdamtheJohnson
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:22 am Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
I thought Americans couldn't get work permits for that part of Europe...? |
I havent looked into it at the moment, but my French teacher told me of a program that she did where she teached 20 hours/week in addition to school |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:51 am Post subject: |
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| I thought Americans couldn't get work permits for that part of Europe...? |
AdamtheJohnson, I did not write that.
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| I thought Americans couldn't get work permits for that part of Europe...? |
Glenski, there are some programs in France or Germany that put recent graduates in high school or elementary schools. In return you receive around 1000 Euro a month. to cover your living expenses. There are also Fulbright teaching fellowships that allow Americans to be placed in a high school or junior high school as an English teacher in Europe. I believe that is what the OP is talking about. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:54 am Post subject: |
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| Research? Well, how about asking HR personnel everywhere? Many/Most will tell you that to get a job, you should show an interest and some knowledge of the company (let alone country). |
I thought we were talking about teaching and not working in a company. |
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denise
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:02 am Post subject: |
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| AdamtheJohnson wrote: |
| JZer wrote: |
I thought Americans couldn't get work permits for that part of Europe...? |
I havent looked into it at the moment, but my French teacher told me of a program that she did where she teached 20 hours/week in addition to school |
Somebody else just posted a question about this--I think it's in the newbie forum--something about "where to start besides Korea?" Sounds like she knows quite a bit about it, or a similar program. She had something fairly specific in mind.
As to the cost of grad schools--I don't know anyone who got a full ride for an MA! Yeah, most of us in my program got some form of scholarship/aid/assistantship, but it was not NEARLY enough to cover the full cost! I always heard that you were far more likely to get a full ride, or close to it, going for a PhD, because you would be publishing and bringing prestige to your university--MA students don't do that, so apparently they're not worth the investment. 
d |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:23 am Post subject: |
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| As to the cost of grad schools--I don't know anyone who got a full ride for an MA! Yeah, most of us in my program got some form of scholarship/aid/assistantship, but it was not NEARLY enough to cover the full cost! I always heard that you were far more likely to get a full ride, or close to it, going for a PhD, because you would be publishing and bringing prestige to your university--MA students don't do that, so apparently they're not worth the investment. Sad |
With that in mind one can search for schools that do not offer PhDs but MAs if they are not interested in getting a PhD. In a foreign language MA program you are likely to get a full ride since you can teach freshman level Spanish, German, French, etc. Thus MA students are useful to the university. |
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AdamtheJohnson
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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| So anyway, the decision-making process..... |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| AdamtheJohnson, are you going to be a senior? Or did you already graduate? If you are going to be a senior this fall why don't you try to apply for a program that will let you teach in a French public school for a year. Trying living in France, Spain, or Germany for a year and then take it from there. You can start by applying to the Fulbright English Assistants program. I know of several people who were accepted and placed in a European high school for a year. I believe that the contract can be extended for a year. Furthermore there are other government programs in Europe that will allow recent American and British grads to teach in a high school as an English teaching assistant. I hope that helps. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.ciep.fr/en/assistantetr/
For anyone who is interested here is one program.
Salary
EUR 949.60 per month before compulsory social welfare deductions.
This would basically provide one with a student lifestyle in France. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
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| Research? Well, how about asking HR personnel everywhere? Many/Most will tell you that to get a job, you should show an interest and some knowledge of the company (let alone country). |
I thought we were talking about teaching and not working in a company. |
Same thing, JZ. Employers everywhere want to know those things.
And some teaching employers ARE companies. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Research? Well, how about asking HR personnel everywhere? Many/Most will tell you that to get a job, you should show an interest and some knowledge of the company (let alone country). |
Of course they may want you to show knowledge but I don't know how much of a link there is between having this knowledge and doing a good job. I might have all the knowledge in the world about playing British football, baseball, basketball, etc. That still does not mean I can actually play any of these sports.
Some recent research in the United States, which I am sure some members on this board will go scream and say it cannot be true, has shown that having a teacher's license as opposed to only a B.A. in a relevant subject leads to no substantial difference in the outcome of the improvement/regressions of the students being taught. The point the researchers were trying to make is that many teaching skills cannot be taught. Thus taking the education courses to get a teaching license did not lead to better results by the students being taught.
Last edited by JZer on Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:47 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:01 am Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| Of course they may want you to show knowledge but I don't know how much of a link actually have this knowledge is to doing a good job. |
True, but that was not the point you questioned. You asked about just getting hired.
Your example about sports is not appropriate here anyway. What job would expect you to know and play all those sports? Knowing about them would be a great benefit if you were being hired as some sort of consultant or newsperson, of course. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:45 am Post subject: |
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| I might have all the knowledge in the world about playing British football, baseball, basketball, etc. That still does not mean I can actually play any of these sports. |
This is an example of a case in which some people know about a subject like a sport but that does not mean they can actually play the sport well. It is my belief that more people realize that knowing how to play a sport does not mean you can play it well than the belief that learning teaching methods does not necessarily make you a good teacher.
Some how the teaching profession has developed into having certain papers driven rather than driven by actually hiring people who can create a good to excellent work environment. |
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ESL Hobo
Joined: 23 Oct 2008
Posts: 262
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:02 am Post subject: |
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Hi Adam,
I have a friend who knew exactly what he wanted. After his BA degree he got a Masters in TESOL, then got a couple years experience under his belt in Taiwan and Japan. After that he went to the United Arab Emirates with his wife, also a Tefler and they taught for 4 years each making 40,000 tax free dollars a year. Then they went to Australia and opened a scuba diving business, his wife is from there. When they feel like globe trotting they let someone else run the business, family. They have great credentials so they can pick the best jobs. When they get tired of working they just go back and chill out in Australia. They also own property on the gulf of Mexico where they pursue their other hobby, deep sea fishing.
If I had the chance to do it all over again and the money, which I did not, at the time, I would go that route as a globe trotting Tefler. GET THE MASTERS FIRST, if you can. Get the experience second, Vietnam or Thailand. Go for the cash in the Middle East . Start a small business to fall back on. Relax. Then go for experience again, cash, the world is your oyster.
Best wishes. |
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denise
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish
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| Posted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| JZer wrote: |
| Quote: |
| I might have all the knowledge in the world about playing British football, baseball, basketball, etc. That still does not mean I can actually play any of these sports. |
This is an example of a case in which some people know about a subject like a sport but that does not mean they can actually play the sport well. It is my belief that more people realize that knowing how to play a sport does not mean you can play it well than the belief that learning teaching methods does not necessarily make you a good teacher.
Some how the teaching profession has developed into having certain papers driven rather than driven by actually hiring people who can create a good to excellent work environment. |
I don't think it's an issue of "knowing 'about' teaching=being able to teach." I got the impression that the quote--Glenski's, right?--was more about knowing about the company/school that you're hoping to work for. It's generally good advice for job interviews: look up the school, learn about it, and tell them why you think you're a good match, based on what you learned about the school. True, doing a bit of research on the school beforehand in no way guarantees that you'll be a good teacher, but it is still a factor that could affect their decision to hire you--would they rather hire somebody who actually took the time to learn about them, or somebody who just waltzed in for an interview without knowing exactly what they were interviewing for? (going beyond the obvious answer of "a teaching job")
d |
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