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simbrosa
Joined: 15 May 2008
Posts: 5
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 Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| alot you make good points and i guess its all bout doing homework to find out whats suits your best. we all have different needs and styles. |
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bnej
Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Posts: 57
Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:39 am Post subject: |
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I'm not sure what the thread resurrection rules on this forum are, but this thread has been VERY insightful as far as help and teaching in China goes.
But the question still stands - where do we start our research? Most of the advice in this forum has suggests that the postings on the China job board are just recruiting agencies looking for gullible new FT's to exploit.
How do I find schools? Is there a master listing somewhere?
Many of the university websites I've visited are not translated properly, have not been updated for a number of years, and some of the contact emails don't work.
I am Chinese-Canadian, and from all that I've read, this makes things much more difficult. I've read this article and the author advised I teach at lower rung universities in 'better' cities or in less desirable locations. Is it really that hopeless for us Chinese-Canadians/Americans/Europeans?
Edit: I should also point out that my main objective is not monetary gain, rather I want to get in touch with my roots, (re)learn the language, and have a good experience teaching. I've tempered my expectations since doing a bit of research on these boards and others...but am still looking to try a teaching gig. |
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JGC458
Joined: 30 Jan 2006
Posts: 248
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 6:52 am Post subject: |
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bnej, I don't know how back to your roots you want to go, but if you know what region your family comes from originally you could try there.
Apart from that, look on different sites, apply to different schools - and even agencies if you want. My first school here 3 years ago was through an agency. The experience wasn't great but it did lead on to much better things.
And you really do have to accept that nothing is certain here or perfect, and that you will learn with time. So be prepared to give yourself time.
I'd suggest that once you find an offer you can live with (i.e. not perfect, but at least one that seems acceptable) you take it and once in country start networking and planning your next move. |
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The Ever-changing Cleric
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| bnej wrote: |
I am Chinese-Canadian, and from all that I've read, this makes things much more difficult. I've read this article and the author advised I teach at lower rung universities in 'better' cities or in less desirable locations. Is it really that hopeless for us Chinese-Canadians/Americans/Europeans?
Edit: I should also point out that my main objective is not monetary gain, rather I want to get in touch with my roots, (re)learn the language, and have a good experience teaching. I've tempered my expectations since doing a bit of research on these boards and others...but am still looking to try a teaching gig. |
Dont let any school use your heritage as an excuse to underpay or abuse you. It can happen.
| bnej wrote: |
But the question still stands - where do we start our research? Most of the advice in this forum has suggests that the postings on the China job board are just recruiting agencies looking for gullible new FT's to exploit.
How do I find schools? Is there a master listing somewhere?
Many of the university websites I've visited are not translated properly, have not been updated for a number of years, and some of the contact emails don't work. |
there are some good resources on this website but dont limit yourself to one. if you want a link where you can find jobs, let me know and I'll send you a PM. I cant post the link here. There are plenty of places to find good jobs and some of these sites allow you to contact the school directly. Out of date contact info is a common problem here, but that usually only applies to email addresses, many phone numbers, esp. land lines dont change. At least that's my experience.
one thing to keep in mind for newcomers to china: your first job in this country could be a total disaster, it turns out that way for quite a few people, and there are a lot of reasons for it. But in these situations the primary problem is a combination of both the school AND the FT making unreasonable demands on one another. In the end, that first terrible job will end. in that first 6/12 months you should have learned what to watch out for, and how to negotiate your way into a better situation and how to negotiate your way out of a bad one. If you take a second job in China, and then a third and fourth, and you're still having the same problems you had at your first job, then I'm willing to bet the problem lies not with the school but with the teacher. Surely no-one on here who's paid close attention to their employment situation over an extended period of time would fall for the same tricks more than once. Whats that line... fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice etc etc...
Last edited by The Ever-changing Cleric on Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Totemic
Joined: 05 Feb 2009
Posts: 118
Location: Nanjing
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:56 am Post subject: |
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| JGC458 wrote: |
| I'd suggest that once you find an offer you can live with (i.e. not perfect, but at least one that seems acceptable) you take it and once in country start networking and planning your next move. |
I agree with this strategy. Coming in blind as you are is going to be a crapshoot IMO. When I did similar, I luckily landed in a so-so gig, but it was stable enough to allow me to get my bearings, which led to better things 6 months later, and then 6 months after that, and so on...  |
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bnej
Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Posts: 57
Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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| JGC458 wrote: |
bnej, I don't know how back to your roots you want to go, but if you know what region your family comes from originally you could try there.
Apart from that, look on different sites, apply to different schools - and even agencies if you want. My first school here 3 years ago was through an agency. The experience wasn't great but it did lead on to much better things.
And you really do have to accept that nothing is certain here or perfect, and that you will learn with time. So be prepared to give yourself time.
I'd suggest that once you find an offer you can live with (i.e. not perfect, but at least one that seems acceptable) you take it and once in country start networking and planning your next move. |
I'd love to be situated in Beijing (where my family is from), but it is supposedly more difficult to find decent employment there than other smaller cities. I'm sending emails out nonetheless and going to see what responses I get.
That is exactly what I'm looking for - an offer that will let me live comfortably, and in a non-miserable school. Like I've said, I've really tempered my expectations since doing some research, but I'm still not going to accept being miserable for a year.
| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| bnej wrote: |
I am Chinese-Canadian, and from all that I've read, this makes things much more difficult. I've read this article and the author advised I teach at lower rung universities in 'better' cities or in less desirable locations. Is it really that hopeless for us Chinese-Canadians/Americans/Europeans?
Edit: I should also point out that my main objective is not monetary gain, rather I want to get in touch with my roots, (re)learn the language, and have a good experience teaching. I've tempered my expectations since doing a bit of research on these boards and others...but am still looking to try a teaching gig. |
Dont let any school use your heritage as an excuse to underpay or abuse you. It can happen. |
I have no intentions of letting this happen but that really depends on whether I get job offers. At the very worst, I'll teach ESL here in Toronto for a couple of years just to gain some teaching experience and try again later down the road, or just fly over to a city of my choosing and knock on doors.
| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| bnej wrote: |
But the question still stands - where do we start our research? Most of the advice in this forum has suggests that the postings on the China job board are just recruiting agencies looking for gullible new FT's to exploit.
How do I find schools? Is there a master listing somewhere?
Many of the university websites I've visited are not translated properly, have not been updated for a number of years, and some of the contact emails don't work. |
there are some good resources on this website but dont limit yourself to one. if you want a link where you can find jobs, let me know and I'll send you a PM. I cant post the link here. There are plenty of places to find good jobs and some of these sites allow you to contact the school directly. Out of date contact info is a common problem here, but that usually only applies to email addresses, many phone numbers, esp. land lines dont change. At least that's my experience.
one thing to keep in mind for newcomers to china: your first job in this country could be a total disaster, it turns out that way for quite a few people, and there are a lot of reasons for it. But in these situations the primary problem is a combination of both the school AND the FT making unreasonable demands on one another. In the end, that first terrible job will end. in that first 6/12 months you should have learned what to watch out for, and how to negotiate your way into a better situation and how to negotiate your way out of a bad one. If you take a second job in China, and then a third and fourth, and you're still having the same problems you had at your first job, then I'm willing to bet the problem lies not with the school but with the teacher. Surely no-one on here who's paid close attention to their employment situation over an extended period of time would fall for the same tricks more than once. Whats that line... fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice etc etc... |
I would love to get that job link...but I can't PM yet - haven't got 25 posts under my belt. I do speak some mandarin, I'll see how calling these universities goes then. I would appreciate it if you could email them to me? [email protected]
I have spent some time in China with my family in a non-tourist-y way recently (last year), so I don't think I'll experience too much culture shock; but then again, my family may have been the buffer which protected me from that. I'm not really sure how the school system works in China and what curveballs to expect, but that's just going have to be something I handle after I get the job and start teaching I suppose. |
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