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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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 Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:21 am Post subject: |
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Rio... you are not aware that Rigel and I have exchanged dozens of PMs concerning his current job search... and he is the one who has been saying that he started this job search because... he is bored hanging out on a beach somewhere warm and sunny. 
Sometimes... messages to individuals may confuse others... sorry if that part might have been confusing to some. I am very familiar the boredom that can be encountered in some of these Gulf jobs. But, planning an escape from a bad job can be very... um... not boring at all. 
VS |
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scot47
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 6:03 am Post subject: hm |
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Before coming to KSA you have decided that the place is a giant prison and everyone here wants to rip you off. You may have your prophecies fulfilled. Or you could check out this and similar forums and see what people say about good and bad employers.
Or you could give up on the attempt to get to Arabia. |
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Bebsi
Joined: 07 Feb 2005
Posts: 958
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:51 am Post subject: |
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scot47 wrote:
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| Reasonable employers donotdo this. Stickto the reasonableemployers and you will be okay. |
And how does one go about ensuring that an employer is reasonable BEFORE going there? |
By reading this forum, that's how. That, rather surprisingly, is something many posters seeking information do not do before asking questions here. Lazy way, tut, tut!
A read through old threads which appear to be somewhat relevant, will give a fair idea of which employers in KSA are good, who is bad, and which ones are downright ugly and to be avoided at all costs.
To the advice that one should read the contract carefully, which is sound counsel per se, I would emphasize the point that the OP is, not unreasonably, concerned here about contracts that do not reflect the true conditions on the ground in Saudi. |
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rigel
Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 308
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| veiledsentiments wrote: |
Rio... you are not aware that Rigel and I have exchanged dozens of PMs concerning his current job search... and he is the one who has been saying that he started this job search because... he is bored hanging out on a beach somewhere warm and sunny.
My my. They share-all their PMs here. Surprise, surprise.
Sometimes... messages to individuals may confuse others... sorry if that part might have been confusing to some. I am very familiar the boredom that can be encountered in some of these Gulf jobs. But, planning an escape from a bad job can be very... um... not boring at all.
Let me see. I can be bored while spending money and not making it, or be bored working and earning it. Which one to choose?
*I dream of myself being a Wal-Mart greeter at 70.*
VS |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:01 pm Post subject: Re: hm |
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| scot47 wrote: |
Before coming to KSA you have decided that the place is a giant prison and everyone here wants to rip you off. You may have your prophecies fulfilled. Or you could check out this and similar forums and see what people say about good and bad employers.
Or you could give up on the attempt to get to Arabia. |
I generally agree with you, Scot. But you gotta admit that many employment "opportunities" have become very dodgy. I can't think of one "scam" that I heard of in my time up to 2004...but that date may be false, as, by that time, I only dealt with premium employers for so long that the recruiters may have been moving under my radar net.
NCTBA |
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dareva
Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 74
Location: almost there...
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:16 pm Post subject: does this happen on this forum? |
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Thanks Rio DArro for alerting us to the fact that two of the most frequent posters on the KSA forum have never set foot in place! Who cares how wise you (think!) you are or how much expereince you had in other countries or the ME - Dubai is in ME and i walked around in a sleeveless top there - pretty useless infromation to give someone wanting to know the dress code of the KSA, i'd say! So I can't see how someone thinks they have the right to give advice on something they essentially know very little about. No wonder there are so many opinions on this forum rather than straight answers. I have opinions about the KSA as well, but frankly, apart from entertaining me, they're pretty useless.
I suggest to those people who give advice on KSA and who have never been there to - not! If you've got general ME experience then give advice on that forum....you're undermining the integrity of what, I thought, was a very good forum...  |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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Dear dareva,
Does nineteen years there qualify? And, having read most of veiledsentiments posts on the Kingdom, I can assure you that I have never found her advice/suggestions to be in error or even off the mark.
I'm not sure who the other poster you're referring to might be, but your comments about veiledsentiments are totally misguided - she is in NO way "undermining the integrity of . . . this forum." In fact, she is an invaluable contributor, something you would realize if YOU had ever been to the Kingdom.
Regards,
John |
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Grendal
Joined: 13 Aug 2009
Posts: 861
Location: Lurking in the depths of the Faisaliah Tower underground parking.
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 12:41 am Post subject: |
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Dear dareva,
I've been viewing this forum for over a year before I decided to join. I decided to join after coming back from Saudia for my first time. I know I may not be a good contributor and even a little too wacked out on cat nip but I know that VS has never let me down. I can only speak for myself but the posts made by her have helped me. Maybe you can see the truth too but it's always going to be from your perspective, never through someone elses eyes.
Regards.
Grendal |
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desultude
Joined: 19 Jan 2003
Posts: 614
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 12:47 am Post subject: |
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I worked in the Kingdom long enough to know where of what I speak. And I also know not to speak of what I do not know.
I also know how and to whom to send PM's.
Speak the truth and there will always be some sycophant ready to toss the tomatoes. Fortunately for me, I love tomatoes! |
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The Lathe of Heaven
Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 162
Location: drifting from dream to dream from future to future
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 1:02 am Post subject: |
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rigel wrote:
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I go to the gulag and find that my real boss has other ideas. I find that what I really get is very different from 'the deal', especially pay (it's lower). I discover I've been had, the latest victim of bait-and-switch.
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"My boss"
Sorry I don't have a boss and refuse to ever have one. I prefer employer.
TLOH |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 2:16 am Post subject: |
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Thank you all for your kind words...  Because my 15+ years of Gulf experience were in surrounding countries rather than Saudia, I do try to stick to general information related to university education and living in an Arab Muslim society. There are many more similarities than differences among all these countries...
VS |
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Mia Xanthi
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 955
Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 2:49 am Post subject: |
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| I will also confirm that I have always found VS's advice to be accurate and appropriate for issues in KSA as well as general ME stuff. She knows very well how to distinguish between the issues she is qualified to answer and those which she is not. I've been reading this forum since 1997 (yes, that long!) and do not ever recall her giving anyone bad advice over the years. |
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rigel
Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 308
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 7:08 am Post subject: |
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| Middle East Beast wrote: |
| scot47 wrote: |
| Reasonable employers donotdo this. Stickto the reasonableemployers and you will be okay. |
And how does one go about ensuring that an employer is reasonable BEFORE going there? |
Well, if you're me, you get mired in the job-hunting Catch-22. Understand I'm a sensible guy and I rely on turnover to tell me if a school is worth considering.
If a school is hiring, I don't want to work for that outfit (unless it's expanding its program). If a school isn't hiring and won't even look at my CV, I apply, apply, and apply some more. This outfit can keep its help and must be a good outfit. Sign me up.
I will only work for those outfits that won't/can't hire me or if I'd be replacing a teacher who has left due to an emergency. If an outfit is hiring a bulk-load of teachers, leave me out. Most people are sensible just like me, and if predecessors are bolting an outfit, I'll follow that herd by not going to work there. I know before I even sign on the dotted line that I will soon be bolting as well. |
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Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:18 am Post subject: |
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What rigel is forgetting is that schools expand.
And every institution will have regular turnover. A fair number of people do come to Saudi with the intention of working a certain number of years and then returning home, or elsewhere, with the savings. And there is considerable movement within Saudi and within Gulf countries.
It is of course a Catch 22 that the most jobs will be found in the worse schools. Having been snared into one of them some years back I was discussing the matter with a colleague who'd had eight jobs in eight years. "You wouldn't have stayed more than a year in any of them, either" was his reply to my surprise. |
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rigel
Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 308
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| Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Stephen Jones wrote: |
What rigel is forgetting is that schools expand.
You need to get your eyes checked and read my post again.
And every institution will have regular turnover. A fair number of people do come to Saudi with the intention of working a certain number of years and then returning home, or elsewhere, with the savings. And there is considerable movement within Saudi and within Gulf countries.
It is of course a Catch 22 that the most jobs will be found in the worse schools. Having been snared into one of them some years back I was discussing the matter with a colleague who'd had eight jobs in eight years. "You wouldn't have stayed more than a year in any of them, either" was his reply to my surprise.
Hopefully, you would have been smart enough to never have worked at those jobs in the first place.
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