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Kalima Shahada
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Posts: 198
Location: I live in a house, but my home is in the stable.
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 Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Never Ceased To Be Amazed wrote: |
| Kalima Shahada wrote: |
NCTBA,
Correct me if I'm wrong, but after reading your posts, it seems that you did indeed 'update' your 'cred' and yet you were still abused. You aren't even in Saudi anymore and you say you are being treated much better.
Look, I've known people with PhDs who've been 'abused' in Saudi. I mean how much more can a person update past their doctorate?! Fact of the matter is, unless your surname is Al Saud, you will be abused sooner or later. Even being a member of the Al Saud family is not in and of itself a get-out-of-abuse free card. So if you think that just updating your credentials will save you, you are either in denial or delusional. Either that or you need to step down from off your high horse and get a grip. |
Could you tell me the name of what you've been smoking so I can order it the next time I'm in A'Dam? Another poster got into it a while ago when a false reality about me being kicked out or banned from the kingdom (I forget which) was under construction. This is the kind of post that I will immediately fly into.
When did I ever claim that I was abused in saudi by saudis? Except for my first year I ALWAYS worked for blue-chip companies that kept me, thankfully, insulated from saudi abuse. I saw and heard of the abuse of the less fortunate. The truth be known, my main antagonizer was a Scotsman who poorly represented his country and Scots alike. (Hi, Dave S.! It's me!)
As VS said later, that the key to me was getting out of saudi and working for a system which treats employees in a fair manner (IMHO...by the way, did I ever mention that I love my boss? Love ya, J!).
Get off my high horse? Where did that come from? How am I on a "high horse" or are you like that loser that I worked with in Jeddah who graduated from UCLA with his initial degree and resented us others who got real with their careers and improved ourselves?
Well, sir (possibly)? I am looking for your evidence of my complaining of being abused! I await your convincing reply!
NCTBA! |
Reasons to believe you were mistreated or abused in Saudi, by Saudis:
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I think it really comes down to the point that if you've got the creds of a seasoned professional, yer golden, if you don't yer fodder. The saudis that I always worked with made it clear that they thought that I, with my B.A., was simply stealing money from them.
Upgraded my credss, got the h-e-double hockey sticks outta 'dere [Saudi] and started working for someone nearby and....much, much, much nicer!
employees of Lockheed Martin Middle East (LMME), always called by me "the bottom-feeders of Saudi Air Force contracts
My first contract, with the INFAMOUS King Faisal School in Riyadh for the enviable sum of SAR 7420 (USD 1978). I had a non-working spouse in tow. I was hired at the ISS fair in Boston. Soon after arrival, I discovered that someone hired jes' the day before me by the same guy and without the same quals as me (at least I had a B.Ed in Education) was offered USD 1000 more than I. Now was I unhappy. I SURE AS HELL WAS! Was I upset at the fellow with lesser quals making more than me. HELL, NO! It wasn't his fault that I had, unknowingly, sold myself cheaply.
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Reasons why I think you are arrogant and defensive (hence, my 'high horse' comment):
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I don't think that ANY of the long-time posters/observers here has EVER seen such a perplexed group of people seemingly desperate (i.e. willing to wait endlessly, receiving poor/strange/non-standard/hard to deceipher offers, offers to bring them in on these dubious
Only in saudi (in the Gulf) can one teach at a "uni" with merely an entry degree.
Kwality kounts!
Thanks for this, John. Which answers my question of who stuck that stick up your a$$ (not you, John). Really! I respect the DELTA. Other than the observed aspects, I can't see a difference from the Master's. I feel enriched by my M. Ed. In TESOL, but I consider the DELTA a worthy endeavour (opps! "u"! ) "Some of my best friends are DELTA holders!"
NCTBA
There's no stumpin' THIS youngster!
NCTBA
Don't preach to me, sister. I've been there and back. I'm still here and I'm goin' strong!
I get a bit "techie" as I am a "back-slidding Southern Baptist...much as the devout Catholics, I have had "guilt" much applied to me. I get defensive.
My bad.
NCTBA |
It did not take me long to find all this ''evidence"
BTW, Homie, I don't smoke. Try to be more objective, less judgemental and look at this as constructive criticism. Do you value other people's opinions or just your own? |
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Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
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| Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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| And another update is that we got another email saying that King Abdulla has postponed university commencement dates until October 31 - although there seems to little clarity on the reason. In the last two days I've received 4 emails from IMS - so they're definately on the cas |
How many more times do we have to repeat this.
The King has not postponed university commencement dates until October 31st. We have around 2,200 students arrriving for Preparatory Year English classes on Saturday. It is possible the university you are going to has postponed its starting date (possibly because of the problems of getting new faculty to arrive on time) and the King has agreed to their making an exception to the academic calendar, but that is not what you are saying.
Last edited by Stephen Jones on Thu Oct 01, 2009 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Kalima Shahada
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Posts: 198
Location: I live in a house, but my home is in the stable.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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| veiledsentiments wrote: |
I've never claimed to have been in Saudi and have been very clear as to why not. Yes, I have a few friends, like Cleo and John and Scot, who like(d) it there, but for each of them I have had a dozen more friends who were there and would never go back under any circumstances. I have enough experience in the Middle East (1985-2001) and the Gulf, not to mention the maturity to know what I like and dislike. I don't like being told what to wear in public and that I can't drive a car.
The problem is that most of the newbies that post on here need information... and most definitely not just from the people who liked it. That would be most unfair.
VS |
I'm not questioning your maturity or your judgment. But please don't form an opinion about a country based on hearsay and personal preferences is what I'm getting at. People are all different and they can form their own opinions about Saudi after they get there and get some experience. Unlike John, I met quite a few expats living in Saudi who really did love it there. Some of them were American women who set up roots and had no intensions of ever leaving Saudi to go and live elsewhere.
As for me, I like wearing an abaya. They can be beautiful, elegant and modest.
Driving a car? I haven't driven in many years and I don't miss it either, especially the upkeep. More importantly, I would not want to drive in Saudi. I understand that many women in Saudi would like the chance and I respect that, but I'm content on having a driver. As for the men, it's up to them because they can drive. |
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veiledsentiments
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Kalima Shahada wrote: |
| I'm not questioning your maturity or your judgment. |
Yes you were, and you are wrong in this case. I have every right to my opinion as you have yours. Mine is based on my experiences and extensive knowledge of this part of the world. It is based on self-knowledge and knowing dozens and dozens of people who share my views and have been there.. and as I said, would never go back under any circumstances because they did not like it - both men and women. I do not base my opinions on the postings here, but from people I knew personally and worked with. I never at any time said that no one likes Saudi. But for the majority of teachers - especially women, it is not the best choice... IMHO.
Just because we don't agree with each other's opinions doesn't mean that we both can't post here. I am glad that you like living in Saudi, as does my friend, Cleo. But posters join this board to learn the good and the bad.
VS |
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jackandrose
Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Posts: 16
Location: The world....
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| Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:02 pm Post subject: Re: ism update |
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[quote="dareva"] When I get the MOFA letter I'll be putting the same question to IMS. If I find out anything concrete, I'll post it (or if you do, hope you'll do the same  )[/quote]
sure i will. saw one of the posters (ISM?) flying on sunday..guess must be ready anytime |
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reneebcc
Joined: 26 Jan 2009
Posts: 60
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:07 am Post subject: Abayas |
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| Kalima Shahada wrote: |
| veiledsentiments wrote: |
I've never claimed to have been in Saudi and have been very clear as to why not. Yes, I have a few friends, like Cleo and John and Scot, who like(d) it there, but for each of them I have had a dozen more friends who were there and would never go back under any circumstances. I have enough experience in the Middle East (1985-2001) and the Gulf, not to mention the maturity to know what I like and dislike. I don't like being told what to wear in public and that I can't drive a car.
The problem is that most of the newbies that post on here need information... and most definitely not just from the people who liked it. That would be most unfair.
VS |
I'm not questioning your maturity or your judgment. But please don't form an opinion about a country based on hearsay and personal preferences is what I'm getting at. People are all different and they can form their own opinions about Saudi after they get there and get some experience. Unlike John, I met quite a few expats living in Saudi who really did love it there. Some of them were American women who set up roots and had no intensions of ever leaving Saudi to go and live elsewhere.
As for me, I like wearing an abaya. They can be beautiful, elegant and modest.
Driving a car? I haven't driven in many years and I don't miss it either, especially the upkeep. More importantly, I would not want to drive in Saudi. I understand that many women in Saudi would like the chance and I respect that, but I'm content on having a driver. As for the men, it's up to them because they can drive. |
Abayas are also convenient. One can wear anything under it and never have to take it off at work  |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:53 am Post subject: |
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Dear Kalima Shahada,
"Unlike John, I met quite a few expats living in Saudi who really did love it there."
I was clearly hanging around with the malcontents. 
Regards,
John |
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Kalima Shahada
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Posts: 198
Location: I live in a house, but my home is in the stable.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 5:00 pm Post subject: Re: Abayas |
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| reneebcc wrote: |
Abayas are also convenient. One can wear anything under it and never have to take it off at work |
Actually, that depends on where you work. Generally speaking, if you work in an all female environment, all the women take their abayas off as they are only required to wear them while in mixed company (out in public). Go to Kingdom Tower (in the ladies only section) and you'll see a large number of us take our abayas off to go shopping (because it's more comfortable). As for your dress code, it depends on your employer and Riyadh is super strict (or it's been my experience anyway). They often change the code at whim too. |
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dareva
Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 74
Location: almost there...
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Back to IMS update: Jack and Rose
The email that I got from Azim today said that 25 visas have been issued and more are being issued. He said they are in hourly contact with EDEX and are sending them out as soon as they arrive. Accoridng to him, there are over 200 teachers waiting - so we are not alone.
I have a feeling that we'll hear more soon. Although, seeing it's Friday today, I dont expect any more news till the weekend. Hope this helps. It's all I know so far.  |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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Dear dareva,
"Although, seeing it's Friday today, I dont expect any more news till the weekend."
Don't forget that the weekends are different in Saudi - Thursday and Friday
ate the weekend days in the Kingdom.
Regards,
John |
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dareva
Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 74
Location: almost there...
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes,I know that Thursday and Friday is the weekend in Saudi - that's why I don't expect any news any sooner than the weekend (our weekend) because the Saudis go back to work on Saturday. |
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dareva
Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 74
Location: almost there...
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes,I know that Thursday and Friday is the weekend in Saudi - that's why I don't expect any news any sooner than the weekend (our weekend) because the Saudis go back to work on Saturday. |
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Never Ceased To Be Amazed
Joined: 22 Oct 2004
Posts: 3500
Location: Shhh...don't talk to me...I'm playin' dead...
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| Posted: Fri Oct 02, 2009 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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| dareva wrote: |
| ...the Saudis go back to work on Saturday. |
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