Job Discussion Forums

clayrview · Joined: 01 Sep 2009 Posts: 62

Hey guys,

I've landed a job with a school that I'm pretty happy about, although I feel like it's going to take me a while to get over to Shanghai. My school wants to process my whole Z visa while i'm in my home country (which is really what most schools should do) but they say I need to do a TEFL course, or I will be rejected for a visa. They're going to pay for my TEFL so its not something to complain about, except that my boyfriend is going to China next week, and I feel like the whole process of application is going to take nearly 2 months.

Questions
- Do you REALLY need a Tefl to be granted a Z visa (i'm a certified teacher with 2 years teaching experience)
- How long does the Z visa process really take?

Thanks

Mister Al · Joined: 28 Jun 2004 Posts: 840 Location: In there

No you don't.
You can get your visa in one day if you have the right paperwork. It might take a week for the employer yo get this; your FEC and invitation letter, then they have to send them to you.

jamesmollo · Joined: 26 Apr 2007 Posts: 276 Location: jilin china

for a z-visa no. for an r.p.f maybe. Sorry Mr al, you get f.e.c when you get to China

Afroste · Joined: 29 Sep 2009 Posts: 15

Do you have any college degree? If so...which? 2yr? 4yr? MA?

Also it would help if you told us if the school you have the offer from in Shanghai is a PRIVATE or PUBLIC one.

jamesmollo · Joined: 26 Apr 2007 Posts: 276 Location: jilin china

Just to clarify, you don't need any academic documents to get a z-visa, It's a general work category entry permit only. How long does it take? depends how long it takes for your potential employer to send you an invitation letter and school certification. You just need to have a medical done and pay the fee at your local embassy, can take up to three working days, or if you wish on the day if you pay for 'express'

Afroste · Joined: 29 Sep 2009 Posts: 15

Paperwork is on average a week for a school to get processed. To get all the documents you need it *really* depends on the type of school, their connections, etc.

Hansen · Joined: 13 Oct 2008 Posts: 737 Location: central China

It appears that your school wants you to have a TEFL. Why start a problem? I can assure you that having a TEFL/TESOL can only be an asset here. Technically, it may not be equired for a "Z" visa, but it may be required for an FEC, which is required for the RP.

Sure, you can tell your employer that you don't want to bother with the TEFL, just send the paperwork for the "Z" visa. Of course, what you do when the foreign expert's office declines your certificate based on lack of a TEFL, well, write another post then, OK?

dharma86 · Joined: 05 May 2009 Posts: 187 Location: Southside baby!

Wow, if they're going to pay for it then i say do it! what's the rush?

Having the TEFL plus 2 (which will then be 3) year's experience will land you an even better job in the future!

Chill, and enjoy.

Renegade_o_Funk · Joined: 06 Jun 2009 Posts: 125

Normally id suggest photoshopping a ESL certificate, but if they are willing to pay for it, then do the course. Only if they pay for the course up front though, and it's not a "we pay you back after you get the certificate and come to china and work for us for a month" type of thing. If it's that type of thing, spend some time photoshopping a tefl/esl certificate and contact some other schools. Any kind of ESL/TEFL certification is completely uneeded for most ESL jobs, at least in China.

Hansen · Joined: 13 Oct 2008 Posts: 737 Location: central China

RoF raises a good point. How can you be sure you will be reimburse for your TEFL? You can't. They would be idiots themselves to front you the money.

Get a cheap TEFL somewhere. Can't hurt you. Forget the fraud, forgery, etc.

clayrview · Joined: 01 Sep 2009 Posts: 62

Thanks guys,

Yeah, they're going to pay for it upfront, so I guess yeah I'll just go ahead and do it!

Afroste · Joined: 29 Sep 2009 Posts: 15

The bad thing with faking/forging anything though is that IF the chinese officials find out, they immediately revoke your documents and send you home. On top of that, you won't be allowed back.

Contrary to popular belief, there are people in China whose job is specifically to check into backgrounds of foreigners and all their documents. It's pretty easy to figure out a "made up" TESL cert and agency its from.

Same thing with degrees, they just contact the school and if the answer is no then...wow....bye bye career in China.

The Ever-changing Cleric · Joined: 19 Feb 2009 Posts: 1523

Hansen · Joined: 13 Oct 2008 Posts: 737 Location: central China

EC, Since you take it upon yourself to contradict friendly advice given to others, why not do some math?

A CELTA in San Francisco costs between 1500 and 2500 dollars. Then there is the cost of living in San Francisco for a month which could easily amount to double the tuition cost. Then there's the lost wages for a month, unless one happens to have paid vacation. In my case, the lost wages could have easily doubled tuition and living expenses. The cost for a CELTA in San Francisco could easily run to six, eight thousand dollars.

Say a person starts out earning 600 to 650 $/monthly in China. In this part of China, that would be a decent wage. One might work the entire first year for virtually nothing.

On the other hand, one might get a CHEAP TESL of some kind to satisfy employers. In spite of their protestations, they do appreciate whatever credentials an FT has. An online TESL may be had for a few hundred dollars. It could be done while a person is stilll employed in the States or wherever. Considering that the useful CELTA material which can actually be implemented in China amounts to a few hours of classroom time, it hardly pencils out.

If a person wants to spend several thousand dollars for a training which is virtually useless in China, of course they can. They might do just as well spending a few hundred for an online course to learn material which is just as useful.They will have plenty of opportunities in China to discover what works and what doesn't. While the practice students in a CELTA environment are usually highly motivated, that is rarely the case in China.

Those who are looking to go to places other than China might do well to have a CELTA. In these parts, CELTA is virtually unknown. It is meaningless, hardly of any greater value for employment purposes than ABC TEFL.

Afroste · Joined: 29 Sep 2009 Posts: 15

Sharing from just reading job offers from 04-present, I can definitely say that CELTA is hardly ever mentioned. TEFL/TESOL cert if mentioned a lot now though.

On top of that, the more recent offers that say CELTA on them are for top schools which require you to work TONS of hours and pay you a salary that you can get working half those hours with a TEFL/TESOL cert.