Job Discussion Forums

[Velocipedaler]

I'm sorry, this probably isn't the best place to post this topic, but I wanted responses from people with experience specifically in Russia.

Has anyone discovered/developed a super-effective method for teaching articles to native Russian speakers? The key word here is "super" I don't feel I've had any exceptional problems in this area, but for the sake of my students, I can't help but think there has to be a better way...

[rusmeister]

The great thing is to identify general principles rather than simply impose the 500 contradictory rules that all the books offer.

I use a simple table for countable nouns - it distinguishes between singular and plural and definite/indefinite (so there are four cells in the table, six if you add two for uncountables).
I use a Venn diagram to help explain the concept of definite/indefinite, showing 2 large intersecting circles representing what the speaker and listener know (the intersected area being what they know in common), and a little circle fully within the speaker's circle and intersecting the listener's circle representing the speaker's words and what he is 'downloading' to the listener. What hasn't been downloaded (in the sense of what he is talking about) is indefinite. (work it out!)

Then we still look at the 500 rules, only in the context of that, and talk about why the rules would have developed that way. They make a lot more sense and students make far fewer mistakes.

I also stress that the general tendency, in Russian terms, is that the indefinite article means "odin iz mnogikh" and the definitie article means 'tot, kotory...' That also helps.

[Velocipedaler]

Thanks, Rusmeister. I, and the particular student I'm working with, really like the Venn diagram.

[spiral78]

This isn't helpful information in a practical sense, but it might help in terms of morale to know that articles are the last thing that non-native speakers ever 'perfect,' in most cases (so the research in the field indicates). Because they are so second-nature to native speakers, we might tend to think of errors with articles as low-level errors, but they aren't. Further, fortunately, mistakes with articles very rarely impact meaning.

Not to imply that they aren't worth working on, by any means! But they truly are tough to get all right:)

[Velocipedaler]

Thanks for the encouragement, Spiral. Your perspective holds true for the majority of my students. I do, however, have some very demanding and motivated students! (I consider that a good thing )

[spiral78]

Yeah, I have had some Russian students who wanted it PERFECT!
More power to 'em - I like such students too:)

[eslcowboy]

yeah, of course it's a frustration. i agree though, don't focus on it too much. it should come up more in context and then should be focused on generally one point at a time. don't overload students with too many rules about articles. in general, i've found that focusing on articles too much makes for students who are scared to speak and use the language. there are so many other more important things to focus on.

[iip]

I teach a teenager girl by “The Good Grammar Book” and we both got stuck with the following example:

The books/books are expensive in my country. (p. 152).

The answers say the correct answer is Books. It means the sentence speaks in general about books. But the girl protested that we speak about books in my country! How the books in my country could be books in general?

Does it follow that we can put the same idea in general and particular form? For example:

Books are expensive in my country.
The books in that country are expensive.

I don’t understand the words of that song.
Words are difficult in that song.


Please let me know if it makes sense for more experienced teachers or maybe you have more easy or correct ways to explain why book in my country are still ‘in general’.

[Sashadroogie]

Oh dear. This is a major source of frustration for Russians. But quite a perceptive student question nonetheless. She should get credits for an intelligent question at the very least.

Off the top of my head, which is not fully focused at this late hour, I'd ask her to name the books. Does she know which books she is referring to? How? In what way are they defined/limited? The country may be specific and defined, but 'the books' most certainly are not.

Sorry, that's the best I can do in my inebriated condition... hic!

[rusmeister]

[iip]

I wish it were a hair-splitting example, but it is from a book for elementary to lower-elementary students.

Please look the two versions of the statement again:

a) Books are expensive in my country.
b) The books in that country are expensive.

Firstly, are they both correct?

[Sashadroogie]

Short answer, yes, they are both correct. But not the way your student thinks. This is a good example of a 'covert' error.

b) The books in that country are expensive. This is correct only if we are referring previously mentioned books - as in the rule about using 'a/an' for the first reference, then 'the' for the second.

Time for more food. Have to cut short, sorry...

[iip]

[iip]

For those who still might find the topic interesting, an example of 'answers book' to a Russia textbook:

"Traveling around the world is fantastic. Sometimes I imagine myself climbing mountains in Asia or in America. I often dream of fishing in the long and deep rivers of the Russian Federation, watching the penguins in Antarctica, or breaking through the jungles of South America. I also think of visiting China, the United States, Spain and the Netherlands some time in future."

Could someone please check articles use in this 'model' text.