Job Discussion Forums

[Sashadroogie]

Sorry, mate. If that's how you define moving goalposts, fair enough.

But does a phrase like 'throw out talk' strike you as less than friendly?

[JZer]

[coledavis]

[Glenski]

[Sashadroogie]

We don't agree.

It should.

[norwalkesl]

[JZer]

[NilSatis82]

[fluffyhamster]

(In relation to some of the previous discussion) I noticed the following interesting section on pages 151-153 (in the third chapter on 'Syntax') of Richard Hudson's relatively recent and (compared to some linguists!) reasonably clear and approachable Language Networks: The New Word Grammar (OUP, New York 2007):

[gaijinalways]

I think to get back to what the OP introduced, being popular doesn't hurt, as it generally will help with your rapport in the class (though I have seen popular teachers who did polarise some classrooms). Sometimes I see popular teachers 'outside' the classroom suck up big time to;

-increase their # of classes (assuming you're being paid per class)
-get the better classes (more interesting, easier to teach, etc)
-get promoted
-get larger salary increases
-do all of the above

Having 'friends' in the right places does help .

As to 'pleasing' the students, sometimes good post-class test results are important, even though some of the language tests don't really do a good job of measuring language progress and/or level.


Now as to teachers having the right skills and theoretical knowledge, it can help, partly depending on:

-whether you use methodologies which are endorsed at your school (either officially or unofficially)

-how often you complain about things that can be changed (currriculum, vetted books, pc equipment, available rooms, etc.), but the admin may have little impetus to change (for different reasons, most of which logically don't make sense)

-your skills being seen as an asset and how you parlay that into keeping students satisfied (which as we have seen from the above can take different forms)

-your students' progress, especially if they are preparing for follow up courses taught by other teachers, including your boss

So as you can see, even measuring popularity depends on whose yardstick you're using.

As to measuring professional expertise, it really depends. Some of the most published people and/or supervisors seem to put in few actual hours in the classroom, so if their theories are being verified through practice, it may not be done by themselves (human guinea pigs anyone? ). It reminds me of armchair travelers; they tell great stories, but few of them are relating first hand experiences.

[redeyes]

You simply can't answer a question such as yours conclusively -- I have studied Linguistics at degree level , have the 'right' RSA UCLES Certs, etc and have taught in 'good' Universities and Colleges for 20 years now -- in that time, I have seen some absolutely terrible miserable, dour, arrogant , deeply unlikeable teachers with PHD's/MA's /DELTA's -- and I have seen more than a few really great teachers with absolutely no relevant qualifications at all.

I tend to think that what makes a good teacher is something that you can't really quantify -- it's indefinable, and some DELTA people tend to get right up their own a___ses commenting on "who and who isn't a professional teacher like them." I especially notice it amongst snobby British people actually. Americans are far, far less uptight about judging fellow teachers. ( Before you start having a go, I am actually British ).

I honestly believe that some teachers actually teach well...... by mistake ! EG I knew a teacher at the University I teach in that had zero EFL qualifications, and zero interest in EFL theory -- but purely by accident, the guy was running excellent TBLT /TSLT classes, and classes that pretty much matched up with Krashen's views on language acquisition. All done by chance and sheer good natured enthusiasm...he had no idea that his 'method' was actually fulfilling sophisticated EFL theory that we had all learnt on our EFL courses and at University.

( Years after he left the job, students STILL name check the guy as their best teacher.)

Stop being so uptight -- TEFL/TESOL is a pretty crummy profession in many ways anyway -- stop judging your fellow teachers. Who cares if he has no qualifications -- if the students like the guy, they learn something with him,then get off your DELTA throne,and learn some humility. Stuff the beardy DELTA trainer with his biro, clipboard and leather elbow tweed jacket.

Who cares? The question to really ask is, are YOU doing YOUR job? Do the students like YOU and are YOU doing your best for them?

If the bloke in the office next door has no DELTA, and the students love him -- so what?

Most students would want to poke you in the eye with a pointed stick if you pranced about and drew bloody "Tree Diagrams", whined on about Phonetics and carried out discourse analysis in class anyway.

[Chris_Crossley]

Even though I have two master's degrees in education myself (but no DELTA or equivalent), I basically carry on in the same vein as when I taught at my current place of work during the period before I even started studying for these degrees, since I believe that I do not need to do more or else to "prove" anything other than to get my students prepared for academic life in England by giving them the skills they need to become effective postgraduate students in what is, after all, a generalist pre-master's preparation programme, where no subject knowledge is formally taught.

I do not even mention anything about my studies to my students because doing so would probably get in the way and they are, in any case, not remotely relevant to most of my students who are not all that interested in undertaking master's degrees in anything related to English language teaching.

A few of my now-ex-students have actually gone on to do related degrees, but I can promise you that I did not influence them in any way; it just so happened that they were interested in becoming English language teachers and/or materials developers and genuinely believed that undertaking such study at postgraduate level in England would enhance their career prospects back in China.

[Deicide]

[redeyes]

Yes, what you say about UK MA's and their 'integrity' certainly rings true -- it reminds me what a farce UK education has become. It seems almost antiquated and even ancient to talk about 'academic standards and integrity' anymore.

It seems something from another long gone age. And perhaps it is a sign of things to come as Europe and UK suddenly wake up to the fact that they actually lost their world place in the late 40's after USA and Russia took up the reigns of power and the remaining colonies all over the world were returned and the Union Jack was lowered from the masts.

Now it's China's turn to be the annoying, arrogant top dog who calls the shots -- and it's UK's turn to provide services to the wealthy masters, China.

I remember doing my MA in London at a 'first rate' University, and there were a number of non native speakers there, amongst them Chinese, whose level of English was that of a fifteen year old, literally, and their level of maturity and insight into the academic challenges of the MA were equally limited.

....They passed just fine of course....

[Deicide]