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gingerlady
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Indonesia
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 Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 1:13 pm Post subject: URUMQI |
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Hello,
I'm considering a job in Urumqi--is anyone there working at this time? If so, could you tell me what it's like there? Air quality, traffic, general feeling of the city, etc.
Thanks |
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The Ever-changing Cleric
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
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| Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| passed thru there a couple of times in recent years. the city looks fine, typically chinese looking, decent air due to its location. the advantage to urumqi is that its close to some very scenic parts of china - tianshan, altaishan, kashi/kashgar, silk road, desert etc. good places to visit in your free time. more recently it was the epicentre of some ethnic problems that you can find out about by searching online. |
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Lipps
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Posts: 45
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| Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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I just got back from there. No Facking thank you. No international phone service. No internet. Crouchers for toillettes. The food is good, that is all I can say I would tolerate.
And for the love of god, stay away from Daguanghua International School and a recruiter that goes by the name of Jieling Chen from Colorado!!!!!! Every twist of every devious plot you've ever read here on Dave's has and will be perpetrated to you at that school! |
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nobleignoramus
Joined: 17 Jul 2009
Posts: 208
Location: On the road
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| Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 8:45 am Post subject: |
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Frequent interference with Internet traffic by the thought copers. Very high atmospheric pollution.
Plus Urumqi is the town where the Kadeer family is based; while Rebiya Kadeer is living in the U.S. of A., her two sons and one daughter are continuously being harassed.
Very cold in winter - almost like in Siberia. Summer pretty warm and dry. |
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The Great Wall of Whiner
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 4946
Location: Blabbing
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| Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 11:57 am Post subject: |
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If you want to live with no contact with your friends and family for one year, go there.
If you want to live for a year with no news, constant political intrigue at your doorstep, go there.
If you want to gte paid lower than standard wages that are the norm in China, go there.
If you want hassles moving around to and from, with police searching you from head to toe or removing the SD card from your camera, go there.
I've met some people who were up until recently trapped there. Won't go into detyails, but I am sure they will tell us all about it when they get home. |
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patsy
Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 179
Location: china
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Last semester I was in Alar, about 24 hours by train from Urumqi at Tarim University
It was awful, even before the recent events in Xinjiang, we weren't even allowed off campus without the waiban's permission, they have people who are watching you, and the internet , although you could access it, was often so slow that you can barley do anything on it.
I had lived in the west of china for many years, but this was unbelievable.
Of course, now there is no internet or phone service available at the school .
Some of the local people very nice and friendly. |
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gingerlady
Joined: 24 Apr 2004
Posts: 49
Location: Indonesia
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 1:52 pm Post subject: Urumqi |
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| thanks for your comments! |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:32 am Post subject: |
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| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| passed thru there a couple of times in recent years. the city looks fine, typically chinese looking, decent air due to its location. the advantage to urumqi is that its close to some very scenic parts of china - tianshan, altaishan, kashi/kashgar, silk road, desert etc. good places to visit in your free time. more recently it was the epicentre of some ethnic problems that you can find out about by searching online. |
Urumqi does have pollution probably not as bad as other parts of China but still bad.Get out of Urumqi and you will find places with no pollution.
One of the problem with Xinjiang is it is a large Autonomus province probally the largest in China.It does have many tourist culture attractions but they are spread out over the whole region.It takes alot of your time to travel to these places. Kashgar is no where near Urumqi I think it is a 3 hour flight ,2 day train trip.
If you plan on doing some sight seeing on your two days off you will find yourself very limited in where you can go in that time frame.
Tulafan is worth going to but that is a three day trip at least.Don't do it in summer.
If you like ski-ing there are ski resorts close to Urumqi.
Tian sha/heavenly lake is a day trip but don't bother taking a Chinese one day tour just take the bus.
I could easy spend three days there hiking and staying in the yurts.It is definitely worth taking the boat to the other end of the lake or hiking around to the other end of the lake get you away from the crowds.Got to be up early to get the best photos of the lake and mountains.
Kanas is stunningly beautiful but at least a eight hour bus trip away.Three day trip at least.Best time is autumn when all the trees leaves change colors could get caught out with snowfalls then and road blocked.
If you plan on working and do some traveling their you need a car or motorcycle.No motorcycles allowed in Urumqi.Get your license in another part of China first it is extremely hard to get your license in Xinjiang.
I personally think Urumqi has nothing going for it even in good times.It is still quite tense there now.I was there three weeks ago.Watch out for people with needles.
[img][/img][img][/img] |
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The Ever-changing Cleric
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| zootown wrote: |
| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| passed thru there a couple of times in recent years. the city looks fine, typically chinese looking, decent air due to its location. the advantage to urumqi is that its close to some very scenic parts of china - tianshan, altaishan, kashi/kashgar, silk road, desert etc. good places to visit in your free time. more recently it was the epicentre of some ethnic problems that you can find out about by searching online. |
One of the problem with Xinjiang is it is a large Autonomus province probally the largest in China.It does have many tourist culture attractions but they are spread out over the whole region.It takes alot of your time to travel to these places. Kashgar is no where near Urumqi I think it is a 3 hour flight ,2 day train trip. |
the distances are vast, but its one hour by plane from urumqi to kashgar and 24 hours by train.
| zootown wrote: |
| Tulafan is worth going to but that is a three day trip at least.Don't do it in summer. |
i was in turpan during summer and its not bad. did have one sandstorm that lasted a few hours but otherwise it was fine. the temperatures are high, but the humidity is very low and i actually felt far more comfortable there than i did in guangdong in summer. there was a night market in turpan that had the best roast chicken i've had outside of my home country.
| zootown wrote: |
If you like ski-ing there are ski resorts close to Urumqi.
Tian sha/heavenly lake is a day trip but don't bother taking a Chinese one day tour just take the bus.
I could easy spend three days there hiking and staying in the yurts.It is definitely worth taking the boat to the other end of the lake or hiking around to the other end of the lake get you away from the crowds.Got to be up early to get the best photos of the lake and mountains.
Kanas is stunningly beautiful but at least a eight hour bus trip away.Three day trip at least.Best time is autumn when all the trees leaves change colors could get caught out with snowfalls then and road blocked.
If you plan on working and do some traveling their you need a car or motorcycle.No motorcycles allowed in Urumqi.Get your license in another part of China first it is extremely hard to get your license in Xinjiang.
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i never made it to these other places you mention, but i plan to do it mayb next year. i recommend a trip from kashi to korla, which takes you the south silk road and across the taklamakan desert. don't do it by bus, hire a car and stop wherever you want and whenever you want. it costs a bit to arrange but with 5-6 people its manageable. |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:56 am Post subject: |
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| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| zootown wrote: |
| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| passed thru there a couple of times in recent years. the city looks fine, typically chinese looking, decent air due to its location. the advantage to urumqi is that its close to some very scenic parts of china - tianshan, altaishan, kashi/kashgar, silk road, desert etc. good places to visit in your free time. more recently it was the epicentre of some ethnic problems that you can find out about by searching online. |
One of the problem with Xinjiang is it is a large Autonomus province probally the largest in China.It does have many tourist culture attractions but they are spread out over the whole region.It takes alot of your time to travel to these places. Kashgar is no where near Urumqi I think it is a 3 hour flight ,2 day train trip. |
the distances are vast, but its one hour by plane from urumqi to kashgar and 24 hours by train.
| zootown wrote: |
| Tulafan is worth going to but that is a three day trip at least.Don't do it in summer. |
i was in turpan during summer and its not bad. did have one sandstorm that lasted a few hours but otherwise it was fine. the temperatures are high, but the humidity is very low and i actually felt far more comfortable there than i did in guangdong in summer. there was a night market in turpan that had the best roast chicken i've had outside of my home country.
| zootown wrote: |
If you like ski-ing there are ski resorts close to Urumqi.
Tian sha/heavenly lake is a day trip but don't bother taking a Chinese one day tour just take the bus.
I could easy spend three days there hiking and staying in the yurts.It is definitely worth taking the boat to the other end of the lake or hiking around to the other end of the lake get you away from the crowds.Got to be up early to get the best photos of the lake and mountains.
Kanas is stunningly beautiful but at least a eight hour bus trip away.Three day trip at least.Best time is autumn when all the trees leaves change colors could get caught out with snowfalls then and road blocked.
If you plan on working and do some traveling their you need a car or motorcycle.No motorcycles allowed in Urumqi.Get your license in another part of China first it is extremely hard to get your license in Xinjiang.
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i never made it to these other places you mention, but i plan to do it mayb next year. i recommend a trip from kashi to korla, which takes you the south silk road and across the taklamakan desert. don't do it by bus, hire a car and stop wherever you want and whenever you want. it costs a bit to arrange but with 5-6 people its manageable. |
I doubt Kashgar is one hour by plane we just had a friend do the Urumqi -kashgar plane trip she said two hours.I have heard others say three. It certainly ain't close to Urumqi.
Turpan is one of the hottest places on Earth if average temps of 40degrees in summer ain't hot I don't know what is even with low humidity.The locals in Xinjiang don't go there for a holiday in summer they have more sense they go to the mountains where it is nice and cool.
Foreigners hiring a car in Xinjiang by themselves cannot be done well not without going through an agency and using their driver and having your itinerary thoroughly analyzed and being told where to go and where not to go and being charged an absolute fortune. That takes about a month or two to organize minimum.
Although things may have changed five months without internet leaves you a little bit in the dark. |
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The Ever-changing Cleric
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 5:08 am Post subject: |
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| zootown wrote: |
| I doubt Kashgar is one hour by plane we just had a friend do the Urumqi -kashgar plane trip she said two hours.I have heard others say three. It certainly ain't close to Urumqi. |
it's 1.5 hours. i took HU7748 which leaves urumqi at 2110 and arr in kashi at 2240. there are other flights that take between 1.5 and 2 hours but there are most definitely none that take three hours.
| zootown wrote: |
| Turpan is one of the hottest places on Earth if average temps of 40degrees in summer ain't hot I don't know what is even with low humidity.The locals in Xinjiang don't go there for a holiday in summer they have more sense they go to the mountains where it is nice and cool. |
its hot, there's no doubt about it. but without the humidity of places like shenzhen in summer, its actually quite comfortable. i spent a full two days in the taklamakan and still felt better than i did while going through the hottest most humid day in shenzhen. i'm sure i'm not the only person who's felt this way. have you spent a day in any of China's hottest most humid cities yet? give me the desert any day of the week.
| zootown wrote: |
| Foreigners hiring a car in Xinjiang by themselves cannot be done well not without going through an agency and using their driver and having your itinerary thoroughly analyzed and being told where to go and where not to go and being charged an absolute fortune. That takes about a month or two to organize minimum. |
obviously you haven't done one of these trips.
you contact one of the guys working in either the qinibag hotel (ali) or in the seman hotel (abdul) and tell them what you want. in our case, five of us, we wanted a car for six days to travel from kashi to korla, via the south silk road and up through the desert. we stopped in yarkand, karghilik, hotan, niya, spent one night in the desert at tazhong, another night in kuqa and finished the next day in korla. the only person who "analyzed" our itinerary was the man who we planned the trip through.
your information about such a trip taking a month or two to organize is, if i may politely say, right out to lunch. it took us a total of two days to a. meet abdul, 2. organize and agree on our route, 3. get the gear, 4. arrange payment and leave. the total cost for everything - car, equipment (tents, sleeping bags etc) gas, and driver for six days was ~ RMB8000 (~1500 per person). we could have fit another one or two people in the very comfortable van we had to reduce the cost more but five was enough. further, no price is fixed in xinjiang. tougher negotiators might manage a lower price than we did but we were satisfied.
meals and hotels were additional to the RMB8000 but those costs were minimal. we found hotel rooms with two beds for ~RMB100-150 per night and meals in markets were rock bottom prices, although i got tired of eating lamb after my three weeks in xinjiang came to an end.
the price we paid (8000) was not an absolute fortune (unless you're a country peasant) esp. when you consider the experience and where you can go with that van. we visited places that few foreigners, even most chinese, will ever see, including a remote mosque in the middle of the desert. just so happened we arrived at this place during a major festival for uighurs. if you want to see the more remote towns and unspoilt regions of the south silk road and the desert at a leisurely pace, you have no other option than to go by private car/van. and for that, you'll pay. public buses just wont cut it.
as for being told where not to go, there was only one place we couldn't go that we wanted, and that was to a working oilfield near Tazhong.
ultimately, the trip was excellent value for money. |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
| zootown wrote: |
| I doubt Kashgar is one hour by plane we just had a friend do the Urumqi -kashgar plane trip she said two hours.I have heard others say three. It certainly ain't close to Urumqi. |
it's 1.5 hours. i took HU7748 which leaves urumqi at 2110 and arr in kashi at 2240. there are other flights that take between 1.5 and 2 hours but there are most definitely none that take three hours.
| zootown wrote: |
| Turpan is one of the hottest places on Earth if average temps of 40degrees in summer ain't hot I don't know what is even with low humidity.The locals in Xinjiang don't go there for a holiday in summer they have more sense they go to the mountains where it is nice and cool. |
its hot, there's no doubt about it. but without the humidity of places like shenzhen in summer, its actually quite comfortable. i spent a full two days in the taklamakan and still felt better than i did while going through the hottest most humid day in shenzhen. i'm sure i'm not the only person who's felt this way. have you spent a day in any of China's hottest most humid cities yet? give me the desert any day of the week.
| zootown wrote: |
| Foreigners hiring a car in Xinjiang by themselves cannot be done well not without going through an agency and using their driver and having your itinerary thoroughly analyzed and being told where to go and where not to go and being charged an absolute fortune. That takes about a month or two to organize minimum. |
obviously you haven't done one of these trips.
you contact one of the guys working in either the qinibag hotel (ali) or in the seman hotel (abdul) and tell them what you want. in our case, five of us, we wanted a car for six days to travel from kashi to korla, via the south silk road and up through the desert. we stopped in yarkand, karghilik, hotan, niya, spent one night in the desert at tazhong, another night in kuqa and finished the next day in korla. the only person who "analyzed" our itinerary was the man who we planned the trip through.
your information about such a trip taking a month or two to organize is, if i may politely say, right out to lunch. it took us a total of two days to a. meet abdul, 2. organize and agree on our route, 3. get the gear, 4. arrange payment and leave. the total cost for everything - car, equipment (tents, sleeping bags etc) gas, and driver for six days was ~ RMB8000 (~1500 per person). we could have fit another one or two people in the very comfortable van we had to reduce the cost more but five was enough. further, no price is fixed in xinjiang. tougher negotiators might manage a lower price than we did but we were satisfied.
meals and hotels were additional to the RMB8000 but those costs were minimal. we found hotel rooms with two beds for ~RMB100-150 per night and meals in markets were rock bottom prices, although i got tired of eating lamb after my three weeks in xinjiang came to an end.
the price we paid (8000) was not an absolute fortune (unless you're a country peasant) esp. when you consider the experience and where you can go with that van. we visited places that few foreigners, even most chinese, will ever see, including a remote mosque in the middle of the desert. just so happened we arrived at this place during a major festival for uighurs. if you want to see the more remote towns and unspoilt regions of the south silk road and the desert at a leisurely pace, you have no other option than to go by private car/van. and for that, you'll pay. public buses just wont cut it.
as for being told where not to go, there was only one place we couldn't go that we wanted, and that was to a working oilfield near Tazhong.
ultimately, the trip was excellent value for money. |
Ok 1.5 hours to kashgar.That ain't one hour.I have never been on a plane in China that arrived or even took off on time.So factor in 2-3 hours.If your flying from Urumqi now factor in De icing of the plane another half hour at least.
So you did not hire a car you organized a person who had a van to take your group around on a tour. Totally different to hiring a car by your self as I said cannot be done by a foreigner in Xinjiang.
This person Abdul probably a Uygur or a Hui operate more than likely without a tourist company license.These people/companies are here one day gone the next.Hence you can organize this trip quickly. If he had to go through the correct government departments it would take months.Nothing happens quickly when your dealing with the government in Xinjiang
I am betting you did this trip in the summer just gone.
After the trouble in July in Xinjiang the tourist industry virtually came to a grinding halt.
The Xinjiang government and tourist companies/operators dramatically dropped the prices for virtually everything to do with tourism in Xinjiang.
Expect to pay at least double for every thing when things get back to normal if they ever do in Xinjiang |
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The Ever-changing Cleric
Joined: 19 Feb 2009
Posts: 1523
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| Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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let me state that i'm not a xinjiang expert, other than my three week stay there. but i am somewhat of an expert on travel and have done more of it than most people.
| zootown wrote: |
| Expect to pay at least double for every thing when things get back to normal if they ever do in Xinjiang |
no, if historical trends in tourism are any indication (think Thailand post-tsunami), expect to pay less when things get back to normal. if the chinese government wants to promote tourism in xinjiang after recent unfortunate events (which they do because the place is a gold mine of tourist attractions) prices will have to drop to get people to go back again.
could you explain why you would expect prices to at least double?
| zootown wrote: |
I have never been on a plane in China that arrived or even took off on time.So factor in 2-3 hours.If your flying from Urumqi now factor in De icing of the plane another half hour at least.
I am betting you did this trip in the summer just gone. |
you're right, i did do the trip in summer, which i mentioned at least a couple of times. so why would we need to factor in de-icing of aeroplanes? and urumqi isn't eactly heathrow, so my plane at least left and arrived on time.
re-read my posts again and then read yours. mine are full of factual evidence based on a real travel experience in xinjiang. you're trying to discredit what i've written through your posts which seem to be little more than conjecture, semantics, wild guesswork and a lot of assumptions. there's no point in carrying on this discussion. |
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zootown
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 310
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:34 am Post subject: |
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| The Ever-changing Cleric wrote: |
let me state that i'm not a xinjiang expert, other than my three week stay there. but i am somewhat of an expert on travel and have done more of it than most people.
| zootown wrote: |
| Expect to pay at least double for every thing when things get back to normal if they ever do in Xinjiang |
no, if historical trends in tourism are any indication (think Thailand post-tsunami), expect to pay less when things get back to normal. if the chinese government wants to promote tourism in xinjiang after recent unfortunate events (which they do because the place is a gold mine of tourist attractions) prices will have to drop to get people to go back again.
could you explain why you would expect prices to at least double?
| zootown wrote: |
I have never been on a plane in China that arrived or even took off on time.So factor in 2-3 hours.If your flying from Urumqi now factor in De icing of the plane another half hour at least.
I am betting you did this trip in the summer just gone. |
you're right, i did do the trip in summer, which i mentioned at least a couple of times. so why would we need to factor in de-icing of aeroplanes? and urumqi isn't eactly heathrow, so my plane at least left and arrived on time.
re-read my posts again and then read yours. mine are full of factual evidence based on a real travel experience in xinjiang. you're trying to discredit what i've written through your posts which seem to be little more than conjecture, semantics, wild guesswork and a lot of assumptions. there's no point in carrying on this discussion. |
First you say "could you explain why you would expect prices to at least double?" then you say" there's no point in carrying on this discussion."
I live in Xinjiang.
The Xinjiang goverment said many times on television and in print that they have halved all the prices to tourism attractions and such and in some cases if you where a local it was free entry.They said it was for the summer season that just passed only.Fact.Every thing was cheap in Xinjiang the tourist arriving dropped dramatically.There where some fantastic deals going.When it goes back to normal do you think the Chinese,Urygur and Hui will keep their prices low? |
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Lipps
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Posts: 45
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| Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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If you are in Xinjiang, then how are you able to access the internet. There is no internet access in Xinjiang and no international phone calls. When did they lift the ban on this, because my friends who are at Donghua Intl. School still dont have access.
I love Xinjiang to visit but no way I would live there. That goes for Urumqi too. (I've been several times)
Oh, and I have never had a flight to Xinjiang that was on time. Usually I arrive about 2am after a four to six hour delay which is apparently quite common. |
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