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elliot_spencer
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 495
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 Posted: Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| Sure, I have a degree in English, a PGCE (certified teachers licence) a CELTA at grade B and also part way through a DELTA , I have 3 years experience! |
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LiliM
Joined: 23 Jan 2010
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Sinobear wrote: |
Let me elaborate: I applied to EF for a DOS position to "test the waters." Their advertised salary: 15K RMB/mo. I asked, "Net or gross?" Their answer? 9K RMB/mo net. Your air travel, accomodation and insurance (which should be paid for by the company) is part of your salary.
Please. 40 hrs/wk should be netting you at least 20K RMB/mo. GZ is one of the most expensive cities to live in (I'd say cheaper than Shanghai but on par with Beijing). You'd have to be either unqualified or desperate (or both) to consider EF as a starting point for any of the major cities in China.
There's really no point in asking for other people's opinions if you're not willing to take the good with the bad. Certainly if you can't make decisions for yourself or take a chance or a leap of faith (not in the religious sense) then you REALLY, REALLY, REALLY do not belong here.
Mr. Ed mentioned a salary of 21.5K RMB/mo, I think that's reasonable and obtainable IF you meet the gov't requirements AND you can back up your promises with results.
Simply looking for the highest pay possible in a major city, without experience, connections, or credentials, is naive...infantile, immature, reckless, daft, (add your own synonym for 'stupid' here). |
That seems like an extremely unhelpful comment. All the OP was asking was if the figure he quoted would allow you to live reasonably well in Guangzhou. I have been offered the same package by EF and I have been asking the same questions on numerous forums. Personally, I would be very upset if someone took this as an invitation to attack my level of experience or teaching credentials. It is unconstructive criticism like this that puts people off using forums. I am sure the poster is capable of making his own decision but what�s wrong with trying to gather as much information as possible before doing so?
As a side note, the package EF offered may not be the best around but I have found them very upfront about what amount of NET pay I can expect to take home. They DO pay for the outward leg of your journey and they DO pay for half your insurance. They have also given me a detailed breakdown of what my major expenses will be.
And one last thing Sinobear. I�m sure you have been in China for a while and have a lot more experience than others. That doesn�t give you the right to decide who does or does not belong there. |
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elliot_spencer
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 495
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent post!!  |
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Sugar & Spice
Joined: 11 Feb 2010
Posts: 73
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| Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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The way I see it, most regular folk would be lucky to make 15k a month. Less taxes and rent = "net" maybe 10k.
Coming from me you should "listen" - It is difficult to spend 10k in one month. It can be done though!
The only problem is the time spent earning that cash.
I once "earned" 15k and took a cut in pay in order to enjoy the fruits of my labor.
To each his/her own. Training center "jobs" are the bottom of the barrell.
I'll take 13k and less hours = no nights or weekends. 40 v. 20.
To each his/her own.
You gotta start somewhere though.
As for the "package" - 13k will do fine. Think 8k to spend = 2k a week. My beer and cigarette bill is just 500 a week. Can you eat 1500 rmb worth of food a week?
If so, call me Susie, we need to meet if you're paying!
Pay your dues.
Good Luck! |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| elliot_spencer wrote: |
| Sure, I have a degree in English, a PGCE (certified teachers licence) a CELTA at grade B and also part way through a DELTA , I have 3 years experience! |
Be careful make sure the pay and conditions are as promised.
A degree in English 3-year diploma or 4-year degree?
A PGCE is not the same as a master's degree in education with linguistics and TESOL backgrounds. A master's in TESOL is higher level than being CELTA certified.
However, these certifications you have are good ones to have. I am only mentioning the fact that the master's degree holders (which is the higher step up for you) often end up cheated or shafted in similar high-paying contracts. Worse for those with a legit Doctorate or Ph.D.
Remember, in China if they can lure the "best and the brightest" for a bargain wage or in an intolerable situation contract, the better in their [Chinese] minds.
Be sure to find out the exact conditions and pay scales for your contract.
What I'm trying to say, don't think on a western level where the "best qualified" get the top positions and pay-levels. China does NOT care, and in Chinese thinking they have a higher qualified person to exploit for their profit and gain.
I've known other "top qualified" individuals that constantly had to watch for being used or cultivated for extra money. This was especially true for those that had published books and had energetic/informative specialized instruction or skills that can generate a good ROI.
Go into China with your guard up, read everything and be a skeptic. Don't let them razzle-dazzle you to get you into a poor situation or cheated.
Ask yourself these questions:
1. Why is there not that many fellow FT's with your education and experience, that pay-level isn't the typical generic FT position.
2. Why do these positions have a high-turnover rate.
3. Why can't China retain the "best and brightest." |
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The Great Wall of Whiner
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 4946
Location: Blabbing
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| Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:56 pm Post subject: |
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| SnoopBot makes some very good observations with his three questions. I have pretty much been with the same school for about 5 years, in part to due a nice salary. Of course I have to work hard for that salary, but it seems this school is the exception rather than the rule. |
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SnoopBot
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 740
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| The Great Wall of Whiner wrote: |
| SnoopBot makes some very good observations with his three questions. I have pretty much been with the same school for about 5 years, in part to due a nice salary. Of course I have to work hard for that salary, but it seems this school is the exception rather than the rule. |
Don't switch jobs, those types of institutions are really hard to find these days, in any country.
Keep your position as long as possible, in these times having a decent career doing something you enjoy and getting paid a decent wage doing it is something most can only dream about. |
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kev7161
Joined: 06 Feb 2004
Posts: 5880
Location: Suzhou, China
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| Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 2:13 am Post subject: |
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| Keep your position as long as possible, in these times having a decent career doing something you enjoy and getting paid a decent wage doing it is something most can only dream about. |
I agree with this comment. We've had some long-timers here at Dave's and every 6 months or so I'd see posts asking advice about yet another institution. There's no way one is going to get ahead here in China by moving from job to job. To be sure, some jobs can suck big time, but ALL jobs? If I've gone through 3 or 4 jobs in a couple years time, I'd be self-reflecting and asking: "is it the job or is it me?" Granted, some people come abroad more for the sight-seeing and shopping and maybe some weekend partying and the job is just an end to the means. Maybe their goal is/was to hang around for only a year or so and then go back home - - may as well see as much of China as possible. Working a couple different jobs would help in that goal. Then something happens -- money is difficult to come by, maybe a relationship has formed, maybe the realization that things aren't going so well back home after all - - but some are still thinking in the short term and not the long and still seeking a new job at the end of each contract (and sometimes not even waiting until finishing a contract!). So, yeah, if you can find a good job that gives you a good living and also satisfaction - - stick with it! |
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Maupin III
Joined: 24 Feb 2010
Posts: 15
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| Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 4:17 am Post subject: Why EF???? |
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Dude; with your qualifications you can do MUCH, MUCH better than EF!
You are certed and have a CELTA? Work at an international schoo0l or something. |
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