Job Discussion Forums

[Zzonkmiles]

[Disclaimer: I've read this newsgroup for a very long time now, but I rarely posted. What I'm about to post is something I've posted on one other Japan-related newsgroup as well as another forum for people who are interested in Japan. It just occurred to me to post it here because this site generates so much traffic. So maybe someone would find this information to be useful. The first half of this post is a reply to someone's post about dealing with culture shock. The second half addresses other people's responses about "bitterness" or "black-colored glasses," etc. Sorry for the length.]

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I think the severity of culture shock you experience here is largely a result of your own expectations and goals. If you are very unrealistic with your expectations (or if you haven't sufficiently thought about what living here entails), it will be quite easy for you to get disappointed. And this disappointment can easily snowball into depression and frustration--two classic symptoms of culture shock.

Can you speak and/or read Japanese? I think the language barrier is probably the most difficult part about living here. Yes, you can survive in Japan (especially in the larger cities) with little or even no Japanese, but your experience living here won't be as enriching. The problem with not being able to speak/read Japanese is that you will suddenly become a child trapped in an adult's body. You won't be self-sufficient AT ALL. The language is EVERYWHERE. And you'll often need help just to do the most basic things (like using a copy machine, reading the instructions for assembling something, buying a train ticket, mailing a package, ordering food at McDonald's, etc.). That's frustrating. Playing a game of charades everytime you go to a restaurant or a convenience store and can't read the label of the food you want to buy is very annoying. "I'll study Japanese hard" is what you'll then vow to yourself. So you'll likely buy some Japanese books and maybe take a few classes. But then after a month or two, you'll get frustrated with the grammar and start griping about how you just mastered the hiragana and now there's ANOTHER set of characters you have to learn (katakana) and this is before you even BEGIN to think about kanji. So then you'll become disappointed and just write off learning the language altogether because you can still "get by" with only English or with very little Japanese even though it's still a hassle.

And then there's the fact that you're isolated from your family and friends. For some people, this is an important issue. For others, it's not so major. But you have to realize that you simply might NOT want to become friends with the other foreigners here simply because you may find many of them to be losers or whiners whose goals are different from yours. "So I'll make Japanese friends" is the next thought. Then you realize that many of them just want to use you for free English practice. Or you may realize that it is almost impossible to penetrate their social circle and that it is next to impossible to gain full acceptance with a great deal of them. So you become an island. And being an island thousands of kilometers away from the people who love and accept you is not easy.

Then there's the job issue. At most schools, teaching English in Japan is not a very demanding job. It's probably more physically demanding than mentally demanding. And it's not particularly rewarding either. Every day is pretty much the same when you're working at an eikaiwa. So the weeks and months will fly on by and you'll feel a certain degree of unfulfillment. So then you might say, "Well, I'll just use the Big 4 as a stepping stone or an easy way to get into Japan and then find a better job after I arrive." Unfortunately, after you've lived here for awhile, you'll realize that there aren't so many opportunities to land a job that's significantly better than the Big 4. You'll find that 240-270,000 yen a month is pretty much what most of these schools are offering. And if you DO find one of the more lucrative jobs (high school, private school, university, corporate classes, etc.), the competition is so keen that you'll likely not even be granted an interview most of the time. If you don't have a college degree, you'll really be at the bottom of the food chain. If you aren't a native speaker, you'll be at the bottom of the food chain. If you don't have any teaching experience, you'll be at the bottom of the food chain. And if you can't speak good Japanese, it'll be even harder to break free from the English teaching treadmill. There is so much competition for good jobs here. There are so many people with 1-kyu and 2-kyu Japanese ability, linguistics/English/TESOL master's degrees, academic publications to their credit, and multiple years of teaching experience in Japan. For some 23-year old straight out of college with limited work experience and limited Japanese ability, it is quite difficult to land a really good job in light of the sheer abundance of other more qualified individuals here. So this is frustrating too. So you'll be stuck in a job that you probably won't like, but quitting this job means quitting your life support system for staying in this country.

You may talk about teaching private students and making a lot of money that way. Yes, you can make some extra cash that way, but you may find that it's not even worth the hassle (selecting textbooks, dealing with customers who won't pay, customers who try to milk an extra 10-15 minutes of talk time out of you, customers who cancel at the last minute, etc.). If you are working at an eikaiwa for 7-9 hours a day, you will often be too tired when you come home to have to teach yet again. This may also involve traveling to the private student's home or to a cafe somewhere. Keep in mind that your time away from work (where you will likely speak only English) is your time to study Japanese, "experience Japanese culture," travel, make new friends, etc. Traveling, making new friends, and "experiencing Japanese culture" may be far more rewarding than the 3000 yen you may get for teaching some housewife or businessman in a cafe after a long day at work.

And then there's the issue of being treated differently by the Japanese because you're a foreigner. When you are riding the train, many Japanese may avoid sitting next to you. When you enter a shop, many Japanese may stare at you. When you're waiting at a train station, some Japanese children may point at you or even hide behind their parents. When you walk into a restaurant for the first time, the cooks, waitstaff, and customers will sometimes become very silent and you will feel quite uncomfortable, almost as if you intruded or interrupted something. And even if you can speak some Japanese, many Japanese may treat you as if you can't. Then you have to carry your foreigner registration card around with you all the time. The police may stop you while you're riding your bicycle because they may want to check to see if your bike is a stolen one. Meanwhile, other Japanese may ride their bicycles too, but the policemen will often ignore them. As you live here longer, these things probably won't bother you as much. But some degree of this will always be there--this reinforcement of the fact that you are indeed "an outsider." This issue seems to hit White foreigners much harder than foreigners of other races, as it is usually their first time being in the minority and being treated differently because of it.

Eventually, you will begin to wonder why you came to Japan in the first place and how you may feel life is passing you by. Because really, it's so easy to get stuck in a rut here with learning Japanese, having a job that requires very little thinking, bar/club hopping several nights a week, and not saving any money (or at least not saving as much money as you thought you could). The novelty of this country will also wear off and you'll find that it's really not so different from back home other than the fact that almost everyone here is...well, Japanese.

How do you deal with this disappointment? I think if you arm yourself with knowledge beforehand, that will minimize the effects culture shock can have on you. Everytime you want to complain, remember that this is Japan--not your home country. I'm not saying there are no legitimate gripes about living here. I'm saying that choosing to live abroad is a very serious decision and should be thought out carefully beforehand. Many people come to Japan thinking it's some sort of playground where lots of money can be made and good jobs are everywhere. They often don't think about the societal, linguistic, and emotional difficulties they will face. Talking with other foreigners about your difficulties may help, but beware because it's easy to get trapped in a downward spiral of staying in your gaijin bubble while you bitch and moan about everything that is wrong with this country. And that doesn't help at all.

-----PART TWO-----

For what it's worth, I've actually had a generally positive experience in Japan. However, I have many coworkers who haven't, and they are miserable.

Many people come to Japan for the wrong reasons. Many of them are running away from problems back home, or are just buying time before they return home to the "real world" and get a "real job." I don't think those are good reasons to set up residence in a foreign country, although to each his own.

So many people have this idealized view of Japan. It's the land of anime, cool video games, great food, beautiful temples, and an enchanting culture. Yeah, it's also the land of suspicion of outsiders, trains that stop running at midnight in major cities, super expensive EVERYTHING, people who are only friendly to you on the surface, people who regard having an English-speaking friend/boyfriend/girlfriend only as a status-boosting novelty, and (as is the case with most foreigners here) working in a dead-end job.

I'm not bitter at all, and I'm generally quite happy with my life here. My original post was directed mainly toward people who are considering coming here TO LIVE (not visit) and think this country is somehow problem free. I'm not Japan-bashing at all; I'm just trying to give people some other things to think about. It's too easy to think about the positive things about this country. That's great, but there are definitely some challenges that come along with it as well.

One last thing to remember about Japanese people you meet in the US or Canada or whatever your home country is, is that these are people who are obviously interested in English, traveling, and meeting foreign people. They are studying abroad, doing homestays, or doing something of that nature. So they are likely to be quite tolerant, open-minded, and comfortable talking to you--qualities that may lead you to say "Japanese people are so awesome, friendly, etc." However, these people are NOT representative of the average Japanese. When/If you come to Japan, you will meet many more people who are literally afraid of you, who are uncomfortable around you, or who downright dislike you. These are people who DON'T speak English, DON'T want to learn English, have NEVER traveled outside of Japan, and have RARELY seen a non-Japanese in person (if they've ever seen one at all).

And think about the exposure you have to Japan/Japanese culture in the US, England, or back home. Most of you, I'd imagine, encounter it at your university--be it through Japanese classes, Japanese clubs, anime clubs, language exchange programs, or some other international student-related campus organization. It's just A PART of your daily life. After the class or cultural exchange meeting or anime gathering is over, you go on about your business...IN ENGLISH. You go to McDonald's, Starbucks, your friend's house to play video games, home to watch television, the mall to go shopping, or whatever. In Japan, you can't do this because CLASS IS ALWAYS IN SESSION. Your brain will get TIRED or you will be FRUSTRATED or AFRAID everytime you:

1. go shopping and can't ask the shop clerk what the ingredients are in the strange bento box you want to buy.

2. go to the subway/train/bus station and can't read the kanji for the names of the cities/towns on the map.

3. go to a restaurant and can't order your food or read the menu without playing charades or pictionary or whatever to get your point across.

4. want to buy a new mobile phone, sign up for internet service, or make some other semi-major purchase and the clerk can only speak basic English (if any at all) and you can't ask important questions you may have because you can't understand each other.

5. want to tour the Japanese temples and observe tea ceremonies and learn kendo, only to find that your JOB requires you to work late every evening and you'll be too tired to go out and "experience Japanese culture" when you get home.

6. want to watch television only to find that you can't understand half (or more than half) of what they're saying.

7. want to go shopping only to find that a hundred eyeballs are gazing at you as you shop, as if you are a three-headed monster or circus attraction.

8. want to make Japanese friends, but only find that so many of them are only interested in using you for free English practice or a status booster for them because having a foreign friend or boy-/girlfriend is trendy.

9. want to eat something OTHER than tempura, udon, ramen, yakitori, takoyaki, bento, okonomiyaki, nabe, sushi, or onigiri and you realize that you don't have too many other options. (It's much easier to eat these foods once a week at your "Japanese club" gatherings.)

10. want to say something in Japanese and people either automatically assume "you can't speak Japanese," or, if you actually CAN speak the language, you'll be greeted with "NIHONGO JOUZU DESU NE!!!" for the millionth time.

So many people cope with this by retreating into their gaijin bubble. Then they begin to wonder why they can't learn Japanese, why they can't make Japanese friends, why the Japanese seem so hostile/unfriendly to them, why they don't have the time to watch a Kabuki play/tea ceremony, etc. And they become disappointed...or depressed.

Japan is a great country. But enjoying it from the secure confines of the Japanese class you go to three times a week or the weekly anime meetings you attend is very different from actually LIVING here for the long haul. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from coming here. I just think these are other points to consider, as they are so easily forgotten.

[Gordon]

Excellent post. I think Dave should sticky this and people should read this before coming to Japan. Japan isn't as easy a place to live as most people believe. I can relate to the part about getting frustrated about learning the language. IMO that is the single most difficult part about living here.

[guest of Japan]

I also feel that was an excellent post. I found absolutely no point of contention.

[Celeste]

I have to add to this that it is extremely important to have concrete goals and reasons for being in Japan. The vague "experience a different culture" goal won't cut it here. It is not some big summer camp where you go and do some cool Japanese crafts, sing some Japanese Karaoke and come away with oodles of friends to write postcards to when you return home.

My goals here were primarily financial. (And I'm meeting those goals quite nicely, despite the fact that it is awfully hard work.) My secondary goal was to learn Japanese. I had to get very specific with how much Japanese I expected to learn because it is not possible for me to get native speaker like fluency in the short (3 years) that I plan to spend here. Instead, I have decided that, after studying for about a year and a half, I will take the level 3 proficiency exam this december, and try to get closer to level 2 before I leave in August 2005. (I may try another proficiecy exam in Canada upon my return, but have yet to research this).

If you want to experience Japanese culture, you have to be very organized about what it is you want to experience, and then be very persistant about finding ways to experience that aspest of the culture.

[chixdiggit]

Quote:
So then you might say, "Well, I'll just use the Big 4 as a stepping stone or an easy way to get into Japan and then find a better job after I arrive." Unfortunately, after you've lived here for awhile, you'll realize that there aren't so many opportunities to land a job that's significantly better than the Big 4. You'll find that 240-270,000 yen a month is pretty much what most of these schools are offering. And if you DO find one of the more lucrative jobs (high school, private school, university, corporate classes, etc.), the competition is so keen that you'll likely not even be granted an interview most of the time.
End Quote

I found the majority of the post to be quite informative for newbies but have to disagree with the above section. In particular, at this time of year(March-April), especially in the Tokyo area, there are opportunities abound! I came with one of the big 4 and promptly moved on to one of these more "lucrative" positions quite easily. As did about another 20 people I know personally. This , I might add, with a mere BA and nothing else. I think the OP's initial intentions were true and noble, in trying to let newbies know what they "might" be in for upon arriving here. However, it was a little misleading in that with a little initiative you can readily move on to bigger and better and better things in Japan. I applaud the effort to inform newbies of the reality that was so realistically described in the original post. It just seemed a little pessimistic is all.
Good post though.
Cheers,
Chix.

[Synne]

Indeed I must say-as I have no experience in Japan at all- that I agree with the language barrier that is installed in almost all foreign countries. I am fluent in French and English; however, living in Quebec without my French skills would have been disastrous. The language barrier it seems can either make, or break, your experience's in different cultures.

Good post

An eye opener to me in some regards, thanks for the advice.

[TokyoLiz]

Zzonkmiles is right on.

This is my second time living in Japan.

I view my first shot as a gift - I got to live in a rural area, learn the language in an environment where few people spoke any language other than Japanese, made some interesting friends, hit the culture shock wall, gained perspective, came home, regrouped and tried again.

This time, I'm much more successful because I've got perspective - financial, career, and personal perspective.

I'm at peace with the fact that I don't have time to become fluent in Japanese, much like Celeste. I'm conversant, but I don't claim fluency. I have met few foreigners who can speak the language at more than an intermediate level.

There are lots of Japanese people who are earnest and committed to feeling out the boundaries beyond the Japanese archepelago, and would gladly meet people who are highly motivated, insightful and friendly. Unfortunately, many of the Japanese folks I know get mixed up with Gaijin who are scattered. They're in tourist mode and they're not up to the challenge of bridging the language and cultural gaps.

I'm not saying I'm great at it either - I sometimes retreat into gaijin bubble mode, too, when I perceive work or social things to be so alien from my own culture. However, to be aware of the need to bridge the distance is the first step towards understanding.

My advice to people who come here -

For the first bit, avoid all gaijin. Simple. Seek out the locals who seek you out.

Avoid language leeches - people who will not speak Japanese to you. Their motivation for meeting you is not healthy.

Keep in contact with your home culture - get somebody to send you McLeans Magazine (Canadian), The Seattle PI (American), The Scots Journal (British). Don't get too disconnected from home.

Get a hobby! Learn something that mixes you up with gaijin and locals, whether it's ballroom dancing, martial arts, tea ceremony or mountain bikiing.

What have you got to offer? A skill, knowledge, a passion for something? How can you share it with people here, Japanese and gaijin? I know some lovely people in Shikoku and Kanto who teach yoga regularly.

If you get really busy leading a rich, fulfilling experience here, you won't have time for the crap - you'll be able to deal with the great unwashed of Japan - the creeps who will make rude comments behind your back, jerk immigration officers, cops who might harass you, because you will have met real Japanese head-on and seen what really good, earnest people are out there. But you've got to look hard.

Hey moderators, I like the idea of making this one sticky...

[Glenski]

Zzonk and I have agreed on many points in other forums, and I always welcome his remarks on any topic. Recently, he has made some terrific posts to describe things based on his recent short experiences in Japan. I think they have provided well-written, sound advice.

This post is no exception, however, I have to disagree with Zzonk on this one point.

[Glenski]

Just read this new post. I thank matador for it because it supports my previous point.
http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?t=9216

[Tonester]

For the record. this is my third time in Japan. I was an exchange student 5 years ago in Saitama and now after majoring in Japanese at university and having graduated I'm back as an ALT on the JET Program. My take on all of this is that Culture Shock can be a psychologically debilitating condition. I suffered from it badly as an exchange student and now as an ALT having experienced the worst of it I have grown to be a stronger person as a result of it. The people who think that they can change Japan to their preferences will IMO have the most frustrating time here in such a country as this, as will the ones who have come to escape personal problems. What I found had worked was showing a willingness to fit in and talking to natives certainly made things easier. Yes, there is xenophobia here and yes you can be discriminated against (positive or negative discrimination) but making friends with Japanese people is still possible indeed. Once a Japanese decides to befriend you, they will never desert you because they believe in the importance of human relationships (I'm generalising, I know but this is from my experience only). I also feel that if you phone your family or friends back home every once in a while it can be refreshing but if done to excess it can give way to homesickness.

The OP has really done his/her homework IMO. Japan can be a hard place to live in but if efforts are made on the sojourner's part to enjoy the things that Japan has to offer it can be a life-changing experience. It certainly was one for me 5 years ago and it was why I have come back as an ALT.

For the person who has been here a while and adapted well to Japan, it can be quite a rude shock like it was for me when you go back to your own country for either a visit or for good. Reverse culture shock can be more debilitating than the original culture shock. I found that when I came back to Australia to do my degree I felt that my own people were ethnocentric or just plain idiotic at times. You have adapted so well to the other culture that you cannot understand your own country as well as you once did and that can be a humiliating, even self-esteem shattering experience. You become frustrated and then the desire to go back to Japan calls your name. You have come full circle and realise that you have changed and it'll take your family and friends some getting used to.

Overall, I think that despite all those factors living in a foreign country is an experience that'll free you from the narrow-minded prison of ethnocentrism and once you are liberated your perspective becomes more cosmopolitan. I enourage all of you people out there in the trenches to keep your chin up and remember that although it can be hard at times living here, it takes bravado to make the decision to fly the coop and live in another country. We've got guts, people! Keep pluggin' at it because it is worth it.

[ellethecat]

Hello. i am planning to go off to japan in june or july. I know you were trying to be realistic and helpful by pointing out problems that occur, however, I found it pretty discouraging. I mean, people react differently to different things, right.

I dont have illusions about trying to make japan like canada (or the west).
Im 30, have worked in several carreer postions in Canada and am reasonable mature. Im not there to party.

I hope to go to Osaka. do you think it might be better because of the large number of expatriates??Does being female, help or hurt in expecting being treated like a person?

thanks

[PAULH]

[Albulbul]

"I dont have illusions about trying to make japan like canada (or the west). "

Bravo. Some people never gain this wisdom and still expect the rest of the world to be like Buckinghamshire, or Ohio or Toronto.

It ain't like that - whether you are in Japan, France or the Middle East

[quai]

Problems in Japan with Language?

I have signed up for a mobile phone, signed up for a phone line, signed up internet access, travelled on the shinkansen, ordered food at a restaurant.

I can speak Japanese at all.

I have had no problems at all and I don't live in Tokyo - I live in a small town.

I have taken a lot of your points on board - however I think you have really overstated things a little bit... Japan is hard - but it is not that HARD... people... don't be scared off.

Other than that it was an excellent post! and like i said alot of your points are very valid - but some perhaps are a little off...

jeff

[ellethecat]

Just to clarify what I meant-I only meant that the original post made it seem like westerenrs werent treated well-treated like people. I only wondered if being a woman helped or hurt this.

Regarding the rest of my situation
I hope to have a postion secured before i go-in osaka.
And i dont need a huge group of friends to socailize with-I dont mind being in a western bubble a bit- tho i hope to meet the japanese too.

thanks for the responses. I found them helpful.