Job Discussion Forums

[rc81]

I'm not interested in rocking the boat, making a difference as a teacher, being an influence, etc. When I got to this uni I asked about what the grades should look like, I believe I was told something like 70% of the grades should be Cs or better. For the most part, I am fine with that. We know these kids are overgrown 10 year olds, they mostly try hard, I dont want to give them bad grades.

There is a very small minority with major attendance problems. The final is 50% of the grade I'm giving. I'm guessing some of these kids won't show up on the last day, which puts me in a difficult position.

Honestly, I'm considering giving these kids Cs. I dont care about any of it. The ones who want to learn, will learn and they will be fine in life. I almost always do what I can to help those kids. So lets avoid the arguments about the "obligations that teachers have." Those dont exist, they are in your head and theyre cliche.

So: how many students do you fail? Why do you fail them? What does your bell curve look like?

[Optional_Toaster]

I think the bell curve really depends on the material you are teaching and the students' own levels. If you are teaching difficult material and they are all barely passing, scaling the grades up makes sense (if you feel it is your mistake). If students don't attend and expect a passing grade for nothing, well it depends on your situation...are you staying on there?

My current uni allows for students to take a make-up exam if they fail, which means more work for me and the expectation that they will pass sooner or later. The first semester nearly everyone passed with at least a 60 because they would end up passing no matter what and I didn't want to make extra work for myself.

Now, I'm leaving and have no problem giving zeros, 20s, etc., for the work (or lack there of) that they have done. In the end, the office can "correct" these grades and I can leave with a relatively clear conscience.

If your paperwork is in order, give them the grades they deserve and move on. I'm happy to be moving to a new place that at least allows me to fail students (though what happens in the office afterwards may be a different story).

If you really don't care...pass them all. I'd just try and make a distinction within the grading system to show the good from the bad.

[LanGuTou]

In my opinion, one of the most ridiculous aspects of the Chinese education system is the minimum required pass mark in examinations. I have worked in three universities within China. The first two set the pass mark at 60% and the one that I am at now sets the pass mark at 70%.

It doesn't make the examination any more difficult to pass per se. It just means that teachers, Chinese and FT, adjust the grade given to the students in order that a satisfactory number pass. That is to say, students that would have been given 50% if the pass mark was 50% are just given 60% or 70% instead.

The problem that arises from this is it flattens the normal distribution bell curve. The net effect is that there is insufficient differential between the top and bottom students. That is the sad aspect of it. Most teachers hate failing students unless they really have to but like rewarding the higher achievers.

I only give 90%+ grades to the special two or three students each year so it squishes every other student (bar a few failures) in the band between 70% and 90%. The overwhelming majority fall somewhere between 70% and 75%. That is my "bell curve" if that helps you.

[caleypatrick]

I'm surprised your uni requires a certain number of passing grades and marks thereto. Most universities are meat factories, the meat being the students and the teachers. As both teachers and students are lining up at the door these days and with a burgeoning Chinese economy, I've found the need for cash far outstrips any need for any type of bell curve. Heck, at the university where I'm teaching, I have carte blanche to fail the whole bunch of them or give them all 90s. I'll pass all but a few lazy sacks who are about the laziest slugs I've ever come across. In fact, I'm handing their mid-terms back next week and I'll be telling the slugs that they really should go home to Mommy and Daddy and play their video games and buy a new IPhone. Funny thing is, they'll just look at me doe-eyed and stupid and not understand a word I say...and then they'll reach for their cell phones for another reality check.

[Mister Al]

[/quote]Funny thing is, they'll just look at me doe-eyed and stupid and not understand a word I say...and then they'll reach for their cell phones for another reality check.

[bradley]

The university where I teach puts a cap at 30% A's regardless of how many deserve an A. It used to be 20%. Ideally I should give marks of 30/40/30.

[rc81]

[KayuJati]

[MisterButtkins]

If I was grading the way I really wanted to I'd give
10% A's
20% B's
30% C's
20% D's
20% F's

This is about how most of my upper-division classes at the college I attended in the U.S. were curved.

However at the school I work at 60% is a passing grade and I grade using the following:
50% Missed final or absolutely never shows up to class
60% Shows up to class roughly half the time and does some work, semi-competent speaking abilities
90% Shows up to class all the time, does work, decent speaking abilities
95% Exceptional student

Like someone else said, I have to retest all the students who get failing grades, and they are generally going to end up passing anyways, so unless they are really, really bad kids I'm not giving less than a 60%.

Yeah, I don't really give a lot of 70-85% grades. It just seems that all the kids fall into one of these groups - goes to class 2 times in entire semester, shows up half the time and is a little lazy, or shows up all the time and always does all the work. I will occasionally have a kid who only shows up half the time and doesn't work well but is fluent as hell in English, and I'll give them like 85%, because in my opinion if they are that fluent they really didn't need to be in class.

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

I am a very strict marker, but that comes from years of working in a strict environment.

If the administration cans me for that, so be it. But I would add some fairness.

Exams are exams. You get the mark that you earned. Papers are marked according to the students' majors. If they are majoring in English, bet your bottom dollar (or yuan) I'll be harder on those students than I would on business or trade or commerce students.

If a 4th year English major wrote a paper with piles of spelling mistakes, simple grammatical errors (forgot to add "S" to a plural), etc. I would rake them over the coals. It's pure laziness on their part.

If you don't care, then that's up to you. It seems like you don't care, so really there is no point in asking us for our opinions. Give them all passing grades and move on.

[Neilhrd]

I refuse to accept any pre determined result for a test in principal. Of course I try to set a test with a level of difficulty which will allow a large majority of students to pass. After all there is no point in discouraging students more than the shitty conditions they work in already do. I also try to include a few questions designed to seperate the best from the average. I prepare students carefully for tests and then trust them to do their best. But I also expect the college to trust me to know what I am doing. If they don't why did they hire me? I am also happy to learn from any mistakes in the process of planning future courses, choosing new books, revising my teaching methods or finding new ways of motivating future students.

But beyond that I will not go and I absolutely refuse to accept pre determined quotas for each grade particularly when they are imposed without notice or consultation, and sometimes retrospectively. Such edicts invariably come from apparatchiks who can't speak English, no nothing about statistics and have no teaching qualifications. I feel it is unprofessional and is short changing the students to accept that kind of nonsense.

I wish more FTs would stand up to the colleges and universities about this. Of course it would make waves and lead to rows, non renewal of contracts etc in the short term. But if we all stood together they would have to change. As it is we are just allowing them to undermine our expertise and authority and in so doing giving an excuse to lower salaries further.

There I have said my piece. But I don't suppose it will make any difference. After all the easy life is too tempting?

[Mister Al]

[The Ever-changing Cleric]

[El Chupacabra]

[KayuJati]

[quote="El Chupacabra"]