Job Discussion Forums

[choudoufu]

i've contacted some schools directly and have an offer in a good location at a good school. the contract is fine, it's just what i've been looking for.

but....

as the uni does not have on-campus apartments available, they will provide a housing allowance. unfortunately this is in a relatively expensive part of china, and my contact at the school sorta kinda admits the allowance will probably only cover half the cost of an apartment. there's some negotiating room here, and even if i do have to chip in some, that could be agreeable. i'd just consider it a slighly smaller salary, in which case the deal is still good. let's just say that given the cost of living at this location, the additional rent could require up to 20% of the salary.

but....

this is china. i've rented apartments in chinaland before and it can be a nightmare. just trying to find a decent-sized place not situated above a karaoke bar, where the kitchen is not swimming in 10cm of rank cooking oil, old newspaper not glued to the walls to cover the squashed bedbugs, chunks of walls not collapsing, without holes in the walls filled in with dirty socks.......

the apartments in cities where i've rented before have mostly been empty husks. no furniture, no plumbing fixtures, no kitchen cabinets, no nothing. when there was furniture, it was cheap stapled-together cardboard junk even ikea would be ashamed to give away to the homeless.

if i understand the usual situation, teachers are assigned a fully-furnished apartment either on or off campus. everything is (mostly) ready to go, just show up with a bag of clothing with little to worry about. broken appliances or leaking pipes are to be expected, of course.

this is different. it seems i would have to locate (with some assistance) an apartment, sign a rental contract, pay deposit, arrange utilities and internet, buy furniture, probably install ac and water heater and cooker, have curtains made......and then there are the hundreds of little things: plates and cups and kuaizi, water dispenser, tv, blankets, broom, toilet scrubber.....oh, wait, there's no toilet.....hole-in-the-floor scrubber then.

all this is to be done within a few weeks before class starts, in addition to the medical exam, the residence permit forms, the paperwork, and all the preparation needed before starting the semester.

other than this little problem, the situation appears perfect. if only......

so any advice from the experienced ones? as much as i'd like to take this position, it just doesn't seem reasonable to have to set up house from scratch while doing all the things necessary before starting work.

[Non Sequitur]

In short it is not a 'good offer'. With your experience in China why are you considering it? Surely you can do better?
I think jobs here are a package deal.
Location
Hours
Per month salary
Internal travel allowance
Airfare refund or contribution
and...
Standard and location of accommodation.
All have a bearing on the acceptability of the offer.
If you are considering a 1 Sept start, keep looking would be my advice.

[choudoufu]

well, it's got everything except for accomodations. and since i'd be arriving several weeks before the start of the contract, i'd be out that much more cash. i can only assume the time spent searching for the apartment, as well as handling the formalities of medical check and permits would be unpaid time (check up and certs are paid for). would also have to factor in the cost of a hotel for 2-3 weeks, which could easily eat up as much as the first two months salary. plus the security deposit and how many months rent in advance, plus the rental agency fees.

i suppose i can pass on this one. too bad. i'll still give them the opportunity to change their offer to be in line with most other uni positions.

[The Ever-changing Cleric]

[Zero]

Are you serious about the bed bugs? Are they common in China?

[Miles Smiles]

It seems that a school that has hired FTs before would be able to put you in touch with apartment owners, thereby sparing you the hassle of looking for an apartment yourself.

Unless you're already in China, why would you want to arrive at the school several weeks before the first day of classes? Perhaps you should find out if it's even necessary for you to arrive so early.

[sharpe88]

It's not THAT hard to find a good place, if you have a reasonable budget. Lots of nice condos lived in by middle class folks.. And they are *usually* furnished

But since you're expecting such a negative experience before you've even come, perhaps you should reconsider not coming at all.

[powerrose]

This sounds like a description of an apartment thats 3000RMB or less a month. And since uni jobs seem to average 5000-8000rmb a month, I guess that would make sense.

If you were coming some place like Shenzhen, then it would be easy to supplement that income with private teaching. But then that would negate the point of a cushy, low stress uni job.

Our school loaned us money for the deposits, because it was ridiculous to expect us to drop 16k on a place before even getting our first paycheck.

What have the past teachers done at that school?

[Yes, Ma'am]

Finding a nice apartment may not be as difficult as you think. Your school already knows which of their FTs will be moving on to another school next year, which means those FTs' apartments will be available soon. Ask your uni for contact information (email should suffice) for those teachers. Send them an email and ask them how much they pay, the quality of their place and anything else you are concerned about. Pick the one that sounds the best and ask the departing FT to put you in touch with their landlord. It's that simple.

[Non Sequitur]

I agree with powerrose.
The main job should make sense on its own merits - financial and otherwise , not carry with it the implication that you need to supplement income with privates.
Yes Ma'am makes good points too.

[choudoufu]

to answer some of your questions:

the school is building a new campus, too far from their other branch for local apartment info to be useful. this will be the first batch of ft's in this location. the old campus had teacher housing.

this will be my first teaching job. i don't expect i can simply show up the day before classes start. must prepare. and i'd enjoy spending a few weeks to a month in my new city as a tourist.

it's not that i'm expecting a negative experience, just aware of what can happen. i rented a fantastic apartment in a new development once - loaded with those new middle class, late nongmin types....first floor....chinese plumbing. several times a week would come home to six floors of other peoples dabian spread out on my bathroom floor. fortunately i had access to the fire hose. being middle class does not mean you know not to stuff plastic bags, mops and old clothing down the cesuo. finally got the landlord/wuguan to attempt a fix. they responded by diverting the wastepipe (15cm dia) through the bedroom and out a side wall. imagine the noise when someone dumps a bowl of marbles in from the seventh floor. at 3am.

i spoke with the school, told them they would have to provide a furnished apartment as is usual for university jobs. they will consider.

bedbugs are out there. be afraid.

[KarenB]

OK...this is sounding a little like Qiongzhou University in Sanya, Hainan. If it isn't, my mistake. But just in case it is...some things you should know.

For one thing, this school has had FTs working on the new campus for the past 1 1/2 years. But they'd just as soon you didn't know that because then you might be inclined to contact them and get the real scoop.

QU used to be located in Wuzhishan, and recently moved to Sanya. They have the dorms and classrooms finished, but no teacher housing yet. And probably won't be ready for 2 more years.

The university is located a substantial distance from Sanya -- it is not unusual for the bus trip into town to take 1 to 1 1/2 hours (partly because you often have to wait for bus 3 to show up for 30 to 45 minutes). In the past academic year, the dirt road out to the university was closed a number of times -- sometimes because the monsoons made it imnpassable, and also due to construction. You can count on this continuing to happen in the next year or two until the dirt road is paved (right now, no one wants to take responsibility to pave it). This means a difficult commute in and out of town, where most housing is located.

There is housing located at the "wood" factory near to the university. Not great housing -- there's this overwhelming sewer gas, and your apartment is surrounded by mud, rocks, weeds and trash (no landscaping) -- but the price is ok. But it involves a 30 minute walk to the uni each day (through mud during rainy season and covered with dust during dry season). Oh...and the area is notorious for bandits, who will beat you up, and steal your possessions (a student was raped on that road last month). This has happened to 3 FTs -- one incident was at the school gate.

The other option is to endure the 1 hour (or longer) commute back and forth to Sanya -- which most FTs prefer, as Sanya is a much nicer place to live (there's absolutely nothing to do out in the countryside where the uni is located except go for walks and get pounced on by bandits).

The only problem with commuting to Sanya (aside from the commute itself) is that the school only gives 500 RMB for a housing allowance, but a modest apartment in Sanya runs 2000 to 3000 and on up -- the price of housing is just skyrocketing! So, you're going to end up spending a huge chunk of your monthly salary on housing.

[choudoufu]

thank you, karen. you are wise.

housing allowance has been upped to 750. i was expecting to find an apartment for around 1500. they said i shouldn't mind paying extra for housing, since my pay is so high.

and anyway, i hate the beach. but bandits? could be just what i need after a long, stressful day. a nice workout.

[hot_water_hillbilly]

If the school isn't going to provide you a housing allowance EQUAL to the necessary full monthly rent for a mid-level apartment, then you're stupid to accept this job.

[drjtrekker]