Job Discussion Forums

[the peanut gallery]

I just recently returned to Mexico after a 6 year spell in Europe. Having a previous lengthy spell in Mexico prior to that prepared me for my return...or so i thought.

Please let me share my adventures of yesterday.

Got up and went to the gym. Its a private place but my suegros got me a temporary pass. As i walked in and started warming up a fellow gym goer apprached me and asked if i worked in the zona industrial. No hello, no good day, nothing. I was then asked what i do for a living. Why am i at the club. Where am i from. How old i am. Who is my wife. Who are her parents. Im sure it was just a friendly curiousity that invoked the questions and was not intended be a grilling...although it was a bit off putting.

Stopped in at a bakery on the way home to get some bolillos for breakfast. Paid with a 50 and was asked if i had a smaller bill as they had no feria. This was at 10am. I was not exactly the first customer of the day.

Enjoyed a torta with aguacate, queso, and ham and chimmi. God i missed tortas!!

After showering, my wife and I headed down to immigration to get the necessary paperwork/instructions for changing my FMM to a FM2 (spousal dependant). We were informed that i needed to apply for the Asimilado FM2 and not the spousal dependant status variation. Luckily i had the printout from the INM website which happened to indicate that an asimilado FM2 can only be obtained by foreigners with minimum of 3 years in Mexico. The fact that i returned to Mexico 5 days ago didnt sway my gifted contact person behind the counter. After much discussion it was agreed that i did not in fact qualify for their first suggestion.

I was then told that what i needed was to find employment and with a work contract i could obtain a FM3 which would permit staying in the country beyond my FMM's 180 days. My reply was that I am not requesting permission to work, but am requesting residency and that my Mexican wife will be my sponsor to this end. The Mexican Stephen Hawking, after a 30-40 second blank stare, informed me that if i am not able to obtain work within 180 days i will be considered illegal and fined. I asked if the husband of a Mexican national is not able to obtain residency though spousal sponsorship (with proven financial resources) then why does the Mexican government offer the option? As a corollary, who would be eligible for spousal sponsorship, if not a spouse? I was informed at this point that it was 1pm and their office was closing. It was agreed that the best thing for everyone would be to come back tomorrow to start fresh from the top of my extremely complicated request.

Almost forgot, was told that the fm2 will cost 2800, registry of foreigners 669 and an administration fee of 791 (written in pen on the official requirements form) had to be paid. I asked for a more formal source for the latter fee and was told its somewhere on the website and i should just go look for it as she didnt have a copy handy.

That delicious torta was now a very distant memory.

Quick stop at home to verify on the INM website what we actually do need, print out of everything, drop it in a folder for the cold war of tomorrow, and then it was off to the registro civil to legalize my Marriage certificate which was issued in Spain.

Everyone sitting down? This one is a doozy.

Kind lady at the registro civil informed my wife and i that the cost to register our marriage will be 830 pesos and we can get an additional copy for 40 pesos, this is recommended. So far so good! All we need to do is bring 3 copies of my wifes IFE, 3 copies of our Spain issued certificate, 3 copies of the all important comprobante de domicilio, and....wait for it.....a notorized translation of our marriage certificate. I almost fainted, as did my wife. My wife, usually calm as can be, replied to the kind lady that in Spain they speak SPANISH, even though they refer to it as Castellano, and that there was absolutely no need for a translation. We were treated to a blank stay of equal or greater duration to the one we received at immigration. It seems our Nobel prize winner in languages was unsure about the Vosotros conjugation that appears in our document. After a lengthy phone call to her out of the office supervisor it was agreed that the Spanish do in fact speak Spanish! We made our photocopies and paid the 870 pesos. We paid with a 500 and 2 200's and were asked if we had exact change since she didnt have feria. We went to OXXO and accomodated her. My wife ask for a recibo for payment made. Kind lady first asked why we wanted one and then said she will give us one on Thursday when we pick up our certificate. We left the office with the feeling that we had aged about 8 years.

Back at home we got on the state gov't webpage and were shocked to find that a marriage certificate only costs 799 and copies are 32 pesos. We were overcharged 39 pesos for no apparent reason. Nice!

I felt defeated. I felt drained. I knew, though, that i couldnt give up. That tomorrow the sun will shine and i will bite into another torta which will sustain me (at least temporarily) for the burocratic blunders and institutional incompetence that await.

Thanks for reading...i really had to get that off my chest.

[amaranto]

Yes, sometimes you have to get it off your chest. I love Mexico, but it is a bureaucratic NIGHTMARE. You have the right attitude though! With enough persistence, things usually get done, so have another torta!

And welcome back!

[MotherF]

I have to admit I enjoyed your story.
But I'm sorry you had to go through that.
I'm pretty sure that the immigration official was just done for the day and trying to get you to go away and come back tomorrow. If I'm right, there should be no problem in the morning. Though maybe he was confused that a Mexican woman was willing to support her spouse?

[Isla Guapa]

The INM office in Mexico City always closes at 1:30, and those in the know try to arrive hours before then (any time after 9), just in chase things don't go smoothly, as happened to the unfortunate OP.

By the way, I thought your account of the government functionary who didn't know that Spanish is spoken is Spain was both hilarious and dumbfouding ! Wonder what they'd make of a document written in Argentinian . . .

[wildchild]

[Isla Guapa]

In Mexico, I am always surprised when not asked in a store or restaurant I am patronizing if I have change!

[Prof.Gringo]

[Samantha]

I don't think anyone who knows anything about the system will argue with you. It's not really considered being "sponsored", as we know it. It's just proof that you have a roof over your head and food on the table provided for you so you won't have to be be out washing windshields at the stop lights.

Also, those foreigners with income from abroad, applying to Immigration as a couple (or family) are entitled to request a reduced qualifying income proof (compared to applying as singles) because their overall shared expenses are less than living separately. If they own a house, the support proof can be quite substantially reduced.

[the peanut gallery]

You are right Prof, i also saw that on the website.

If you all care to indulge me, i will continue my story.

The registro civil continues to be a bastion of hope in a sea of....ah never mind....i'll stop with the sarcasm and let the story stand on its own.

I have not made it back to INM as im waiting for my acto de matrimonio still. If you recall i claimed i was overcharged 39 pesos as they charged me 870 rather than the correct 831 and they were reluctant to give me a recibo for the payment. Well it seems that i was incorrect. I looked at the wrong charge on the government website. Registering the marriage actually costs 422 pesos!!!! We were given a recibo for 422 pesos even though we paid 870. Wonderwoman said that the difference was the fee of the licenciado (ie state worker providing public service) and that she was not able to provide a recibo for his fee. My wife mentioned that said licenciado is not a public notary and given his position in the state government it is illegal for him to charge for such services (services such as doing his job which the govt already pays him for). We received a well thought out shoulder shrug for a reply. At this point i walked out and let my wife deal with the intellectual cripple on her own, her reward for abundant patience!

Torta anyone? Nah, me neither.

My wife refused to accept the acto de matrimonio and asked when Mr. Scruples was available for comment. He arrives at work at the crack of noon we were told and will power through his work till about 2pm. My wife insisted that we will accept that we paid 870 as long as we get a recibo for the same amount. That, of course, is never going to happen as it amounts to a written confirmation of theft and corruption from our dear licenciado. We will be back tomorrow to speak directly with him and give him one last chance to either refund us or hand us a recibo.

After informing my suegra of this episode, she called her brother. In a delightful twist of fate he happens to be 3rd in charge of an important state ministry...the exact department which runs the Registro Civil! What our licenciado will find out tomorrow is that he has attempted to rob the niece of his boss and shown himself to be corrupt in front of someone who can fire him for his actions.

Torta anyone? I think i'll have two! Update to follow.

[MotherF]

I can't wait to find out what happens. You should think of writing the screen play for a telenovels!

When I was married, here in Mexico, we paid the set fee for a marriage at our domicillio on the weekend. Both of which imply an extra fee. It was only much later, when registering my first born, that I noticed the marriage certificate was dated two days earlier. We are recorded as having been married at Registro Civil on a weekday.

[geaaronson]

And so I am in the midst of my own nightmare, partly of my making, partly the last school that I worked for, partly of the present school, and lastly of INM.
As a consequence of so many people making mistakes on my 5th renewal of my FM3, I am still without a current FM3 which expired as of September 24, and spent 40 minutes waiting for the bureaucrats review the final parts of my application and then mistakenly assuming that I was continuing my previous status, and not the change to the FM3 independiente which was explicitly mentioned in my letter to INM. How they glossed over that detail I don`t know.

Apparently, the law is that when you are no longer working for a school, they are supposed to issue you a document attesting their lack of interest in renewing the contract. Failure to do so and INM fines them. Well, I was never issued such a document.

My new school neglected to put on their letter to INM as to the amount of money they would pay me monthly, how many hours of employment, and the exact title of the signee.

My mistake was in the original application putting down immigrante when it should have read no immigrante.

So the saga goes on.

[Samantha]

geaaronson wrote:

[Professor]

[the peanut gallery]

A resolution has been reached regarding the registro civil! No further torta references, i promise.

The licenciado showed up at his place of work/theft on Friday morning, and only 45 mintues late...not showing off, not falling behind! During our wait the receptionist said we were very gallant to protest his "fee" as nobody ever does so, although we should expect him to be rather annoyed.

Upon Mr. Licenciado's arrival he explained that everyone knows of the expenses he must incur to produce the document we require and that was the reason for his fee. When asked to give more details he was emphatic that printer toner was driving him to the poor house and that paper was not getting any cheaper. On queue, his anger built as we reminded him that these were the concerns of his office and that such expenses cannot be passed on to the public. We again stated our willingness to accept his fee so long as he invoiced us. At this point he raised his voice at us, saying we knew damn well that he cant give us a receipt for this charge. It was now my wifes turn to lose her cool; licenciado was made aware he had just shouted at the neice of his boss and that boss man was aware of his affinity for theiving bastardry. You could hear a pin drop...if there were any pins in the office as we all know damn well that those babies are expensive as hell too!

Result? Our now blue faced Lic. said he didnt want to bother his boss for a trivial 400 and that since we are being so difficult he will just refund us. He added that he resented the fact that we have put a price on his job. Perhaps im from another planet but i see it as quite the opposite and stated so. He couldnt see the irony of his statement.

Final (in)dignity? Lic. approached the cash box at the receptionists desk and took out 400 pesos for us. The receptionist had to remind him in a hilariously patronizing tone that this was the offices (State govt) money and not his. Then, with a face as long as a week in jail, he pulled out the cash directly from his wallet to give us. Unfortunately he was 40 pesos short and had to borrow it from the receptionist!

Thats all for now, but i will be back at INM on Thursday. I may have to pull out the big guns (suegra's mol�) for this one!

[Prof.Gringo]