Job Discussion Forums

[Professor]

[Professor]

[Professor]

[Professor]

[MotherF]

I felt like I didn't really know enough about the Mexico City job market to respond to this thread so I decided to investigate. I just spent about 10 minutes reading the jobs posted on Mexico City's Craig's list throughout the month of Oct.

http://mexicocity.es.craigslist.com.mx/edu/

I must say it was a rather humorous way to spend 10 minutes.
One job admits their pay is "below average".
A couple of others annouce the job as being "minimum wage". While asking for 5 years experience!
One boasts that it is "close to minimum wage."

Then there is the one in need of a teacher for "arrogant" business executives.

And how about the one where you get to teach "children a feelings vocabulary at an early age"! (That job is actually located in India--not sure why they are advertizing in Mexico?)

In general several postings for individual classes in the 50 to 100 peso range taking you to the four corners of the city. But I agree this is the wrong time of year to be looking for a full time position, so the picking are naturally slim.

[Guy Courchesne]

[TeresaLopez]

To slightly change the subject. People are talking about the low salaries paid to profesional teachers, but are we really talking about people with professional qualifications, or people with a 1 month or 2 month certificate?
I agree that the job with a $6000 peso salary was low, but they also weren�t asking for a native speaker, but rather someone with a Teacher�s Diploma, which is at MOST a 6 month course. A real professional teacher, one with a degree in Education will make a very good salary here in an international school, work all day, and receive a benefits package. Even some of the smaller private schools pay in the $10,000 - $12.000 range, with benefits. Yes, the lower salaries do exist, no one is saying they don�t, but if you want the cream of the crop jobs, you have to have cream of the crop qualifications. To draw a parellel, if you take a one month course in, say, nail design, how much money are you going to make? Not a lot. I think the same is true with a 1 month teaching certificate. It�s not a professional credential. Also, you have to consider the country you are living in and what citizens with similar education earn, and I think you will still find that an English teacher, even working 4 or 5 hours a day is earning a decent salary by many people�s criteria. The point about a couple of generations living under the same roof is a valid point, but by the same token I know several teachers who want to live in trendy areas, where rent is double, or triple, what it would be in a typical non-trendy, but still safe area. Rent is far, far cheaper here, as well as food and transportation, so it�s comparing apples and oranges to say you need a US salary to survive, or even to live well. How about this budget on an $8000 peso salary, for one person:

Rent - $2500 - $3000 for a 1 bedroom apartment
Electric - $500
Water - $150
Transportation - $900 (this would be 10 bus fares, or ten Metro tickets per day)
Groceries - $1500
Eating out - $500
Telephone/Internet - $400
Cable TV - $200
Cell phone - $200

Still just $7000 pesos, and probably many of these expenses would be lower some months. Even though we don�t pay rent, we spend less than
$6000 pesos a month for all of the above for TWO people, including eating out a couple of times a week, soccer tickets once a month or so, beer on weekends and an occasional taxi. Is there something I am missing?

[Tretyakovskii]

Prof is going through a rough patch, at the moment. We've all been there, I suspect. I've been at this for two decades, and I've gotten tired of teaching a couple of times along the way, and taken a little time off by cutting hours. Then, there's been those times, like in Mexico, when I had to put in a lot of legwork to make something happen; but, something has always come along, sooner or later, to make it seem worthwhile.

For those who feel they could have a classroom presence and can get the hang of grammatical concepts- especially those with an entrepreneurial bent and a willingness to put themselves forward- it's possible to make more than just a little money at this, and enjoy the privilege of going almost anywhere in the world to live and work.

[Prof.Gringo]

[TeresaLopez]

[PlayadelSoul]

Teresa, a large part of our student population is in the same situation as your waiter. We have gardeners, busboys, waiters, etc. who probably pay 1/4 or 1/3 of their monthly income to study with us. In some cases, their employess help out but that is not the norm. The bottom line, however, is that they see their studies as an investment. A decent level of English is worth more than a college degree in this part of Mexico.

We pay our teachers a decent hourly rate but try not to raise our prices too much, every year, so as to not price out the part of the public that needs us the most. My teachers understand this economic dynamic, as I think most teachers do.

You are right about another thing, as well. It takes a few years to see the fruits of your labor in this business. A lot of foreigners come here thinking that they are special and should be accorded "status" because of that. They are shocked to find out that there are hundreds (if not thousands) just like them. Some go home broke and busted. Others stick it out, adjust to new realities and prosper.

[MotherF]

I don't agree that Mexico is a good place for newbies.

You can easily live in Japan without speaking any Japanese--I know I did it, and witnessed tons of other TEFLers do it too. The schools in Japan also take care of everything for you--something I've noticed most Mexican schools do not. For example the schools in Japan either have fully furnished apartments ready for you to move into or deal with your landlord for you. They also handle all your paper work. Pay your utility bills (they take it out of your pay, but they handle making the payment.) They basically don't expect a TEFLer to be able to do anything for themselves so they do it all for you. And the majority of the restuarants have pictures or food displays so you only have to point. Everything is digitalized so when shopping you only have to look at the number on the cash register, you can navagate the train system by counting stations. ETC. ETC.

While the peanut gallery mentioned that there were only two full time jobs at his local ITESM branch, that's just one. There are many many of them all over the country. There are also other universities public and private that pay their English teachers the same rates they pay all their professors. But like Teresa said, these are not positions you get with an 120 hour teaching certificate.

[Guy Courchesne]

Playa, how would you describe the teachers that come to work at your school? Would you say they are there for 6 months to a year for the experience then back home or off to other locales? Are they the type that make a career out of teaching at HH like you, or moving up the ladder in general?

I've seen every type of objective in people coming to teach in Mexico over the years. I'd say the largest group is here for the experience and to learn Spanish, and they usually stay no more than a year. Another large group are those that have made Mexico home, like me, and have worked on developing themselves professionally. They are found working at places like Greengates, Tec, and the American School among others. They are career teachers, not earning as much as they would in Canada or the US, but earning very well.

Others that have stayed have done as Phil did in trying their hand at the business English class market, hiring others while they manage clients and schedules. Not an easy route to go but I've seen a good number that have survived their first years trying and continue to succeed.

Those that fail? There are plenty...why do they fail at it? A good number of reasons but my guess is not having a clear direction or objective is number one. In TEFL, and in Mexico, it takes a lot of work to move up and you have to have focus.

[PlayadelSoul]

I currently have 16 teachers on staff. Over half of them have been with me for over three years. I hire some teachers, knowing that they may only be with us for a year or so. Normally, when I hire a foreigner, I like for them to have some ties to the community (family, long time residency, etc.), but I have made expceptions.

I get a lot of graduating post-CELTA (from IH) applicants, whom I will hire if I get the feeling they are serious about ESL as a career. You kind of develop a sense of who is doing it for "fun" and who is serious.

In my seven years at the helm, I have had five teachers leave due to promotion. In fact, one of my ex-teachers (when I was an AC in Merida) is now my boss. Took some getting used to.

[gregd75]