Job Discussion Forums

[Lilas]

Apologies but am starting a new thread to try and get a reply.
Is it usual for application forms to ask about which nationality applicants consider will have greatest difficulty adapting to British life? Or will suffer from culture shock? This is the first time I have come across this and just wondered if it's the norm.
Thanks

[coledavis]

It's new to me, but my tip would be to look up information about how Japanese students are different from most European students. It is relevant. Their attitudes to education and society more generally, for example, make them feel self-conscious in a communicative classroom where people are encouraged to talk to each other about a range of subjects.

[naturegirl321]

That's a bit of an odd question. It would depend on personal expeirence, the type of person, age, etc. Pretty hard to answer.

[Lilas]

It asks about Japanese women, Arab men, Spanish men, African women and Italian women, asking who would suffer from the greatest culture shock when arriving in England for the first time.
I find this question a bit inappropriate - and odd - given that it just asks about England and implies all people from a continent are the same, amongst other things!

[coledavis]

It may be inappropriate if considering it from the position of unfair discrimination, e.g. denying somebody a service, but being aware of educational differences is another case. Although of course individuals differ, it is nevertheless the case that there are cultural differences and they really do have an impact on the classroom.

One of the books recommended as pre-course reading is called Learner English and deals with nothing but differences between cultures in an educational context.

This being the case, I don't agree with your argument that it is somehow inappropriate. It is not asking for stereotyping; it is asking about very real differences. If you are brought up in different ways, then you will react to new experiences (e.g. learning a new language) in different ways.

Ok, imagine it the other way. You find yourselves in, say, Russia.

The teachers will quite understandably come to some conclusions about the strange English and American students who - on the whole - have the following problems:

Most of them can't pronounce 'ch' ('kh' if you like) and can't roll their r's (although the Scottish ones can). They tend not to see the point in pronouncing every single syllable; apparently, elision (leaving out the occasional sound) is part of their culture (although the Welsh are exceptions). While we Russian men shake hands every day, many of these westerners don't seem to do it much - weird! And they often get upset if we ask them about their earnings or if we look at what they're writing on the computer.

Is it a bit clearer now?

[Lilas]

I can understand the point of the question if it were referring to language learning, but is specifically asks about culture shock when arriving in England. It doesn't mention education or learning.

[coledavis]

[Lilas]

I also find it a little odd as I would have thought most people who do a CELTA do so because they do not want to teach in the UK, so why the focus on culture shock in England? I certainly don't intend to return to England in a hurry so for me it would be irrelevant. I already passed an interview to do a CELTA but thought I'd investigate options in the UK too, which is how I came across this and so wondered if this was a standard question in England.

[spiral78]

I agree it's an odd and probably very dodgy question. But just for fun, I'll speculate about answering it. It's a chance to practice highly un-PC and dodgy stereotyping

It asks about Japanese women, Arab men, Spanish men, African women and Italian women, asking who would suffer from the greatest culture shock when arriving in England for the first time

Japanese women: I have little experience with Japanese students at all, but I suppose this group might find people to be open and unrestrained to a degree they would consider rude....and they would likely find it very difficult to participate actively in a speaking class.

Arab men: Obviously may have trouble adjusting to a culture where women are equally mixed with men. May cause problems in the classroom as well - they can refuse to work with women, or go a bit too far in the other direction, not knowing where 'normal' boundaries are.

Spanish men: may have obvious time and punctuality issues, and find that people take things far too seriously in general. Class starts at 8.30? What's wrong with showing up at 9.00? Homework?

African women: This one is really not fair. Africa has a huge range of cultural norms. These women may range from being used to associating with men on a daily basis - or not. They may come from a literate culture - or not. Computer use may be entirely new to them - or not. They will likely already be multi-lingual, and usually seem to learn quickly, in terms of speaking/listening.

Italian women: Well, I think they're going to also have punctuality problems in some cases, but they are probably the easiest of this mix in terms of fitting in. Usually hard-working, well-educated, fairly liberal and well assimilated in terms of work and school....

Anyway, it's a totally weird question for a CELTA provider.

Anyone want to elaborate on or refute my stereotypes? I'm not particularly attached to them in terms of vouching for their accuracy!

[Lilas]

I work with close to 20 different nationalities so I can give the typical British stereotype: scruffy with no dress sense; very fussy when it comes to health and safety; always punctual; usually polite and always apologizing for no reason; reserved and will have no bodily contact; has no pride in their country; drinks heavily and has no idea how to appreciate decent food; drives slowly; loves to queue; drinks a lot of tea and stops everything at 4 o'clock for cucumber sandwiches ...
Sounds like a typical Brit?! I say this being British!

[TeresaLopez]

I think the more different from Western culture, the more culture shock, so I would rule out the Spaniard and the Italian, there will be differences, but they won�t be huge. I agree with whoever said Africa is really impossible to answer. Are we talking about Morrocans? Kenyan? South Africans? Three very different possibilities. I would say either the Arab or the Japanese, just because the cultures are so different, but aside from that, it would depend on the individual and their background as well. Wierd question. Or maybe they aren�t really interested in your answer, per se, but rather your logic in explaining your choice.

[Lilas]

Well it has put me off from applying there - I think I'll spend my cash elsewhere.

[artemisia]

Good idea. It is a strange question and I think the degree of culture shock would, to some extent, be determined by language ability. The better able you can communicate, the fewer chances there are of experiencing truly bewildering situations. Of course some things are going to be a 'shock' but at least if you can ask for things to be explained, that will be a help. The other most immediate aspect would be if you are obviously visually different from everyone around you, stick out like a sore thumb and can't "pass". London would be the most comfortable place in this regard but many of the popular summer school places are flooded in the summer time with all nationalities.

So many people these days are quite well travelled and will have had short holidays all over the world. It's as though that question is geared towards those supposedly coming from some backwaters who have never set foot outside their own country before.

[Justin Trullinger]

I'm guessing it's a "no right answer" question, just designed (not too well) to show that you're capable of thinking about causes of culture shock. It's not a great question, but I don't find it too dodgy- just pick and answer, and list your reasons why it's true.


Best,
Justin

[naturegirl321]