Job Discussion Forums

[emilyd86]

Hey all,

I got my CELTA last January ( a year and a couple months ago), taught adults in nyc for a couple months (super easy!) and then flew down to Colombia to teach in a private colegio for the year.

I had never taught high school and my job is teaching English Lit. I believe I am relatively strict (though I may have wavered some at first, and was generally unaware of some things in grading policies etc). My kids are not usually TOTALLY out of control, but they complain that I am too strict, yet I don't feel that they respect me! I have to remind again and again, and finally threaten (such as, if you don't sit down now you will get a minus) before they obey. I have had students claim that I lost their homework, and the administration, when facing lack of proof on either side, sides with the student.

A student told me today that I am going to be fired for the problems I have with his class (seniors). They think I am disrespectful (not all of them, just the seniors). I asked a boy to sit down, when he did not, I gave him a minus (standard) and he basically yelled in my face and stormed out to complain to my boss. It's incredible. They take very little responsibility and sometimes I feel as if everything that ever goes wrong in the class, even a kid not doing his homework, ends up being my fault.

Basically, I feel like my kids neither like me or respect me I have consistent consequences, but many of them continue to misbehave, wander around the classroom, speak in Spanish etc. I do have one group that is very well behaved, which is a breath of fresh air. The other two (11th and 8th graders) are making my life hell more often than not. An 8th grader today told me she doesn't see me as an authority figure because I am "so young" ( I am 24; she is 14!)

I guess I am looking for ideas (do I dig my heels in and fight them more? I am getting tired.. or should I let them have their way more and accept that I am not really an authority in this situation?) as well as other people's stories about Colombia specifically as well as Latin America in general and discipline issues. The school year is almost over so I don't think the situation will change too much, but I feel like I am going through a rough patch. Is this just how first year teaching is? Can I learn to manage my classes better?

Also, my school is private, and the kids are pretty spoiled/feel entitled. My boss told me when she hired me that teaching here is a dream compared to school in the states.. I guess she thought we all brought guns to school, because that has not been my experience based on how my friends and I acted in high school in the states.

Help!

Thank you in advance

[Prof.Gringo]

[HLJHLJ]

What a miserable situation to be in, I really feel for you.

I completely agree with Prof Gringo, do whatever you need to do to survive the end of the year. It's too late to do much else now.

Long term, there are things you can do to help stop the situation happening again. As has been said, have rules at the start, so they cannot say they don't know what it expected of them. Have a sign in sheet for homework. I.e. they hand it in to you and either you sign their workbook to say it's been handed in, or they sign a book that you keep. In theory you then have proof if they claim homework is 'lost' in practice, they are unlikely to try that one if they know there is proof.

More generally, take the conflict out of your class management. Start what is effectively a 'naughty list'. Every time a kid plays up, their name goes on the top right corner of the board. If their name is up there at the end of class they get extra homework, if it goes up twice or three times (whatever you think is appropriate), they get a minus, demerit, whatever you have to sanction them with. If they behave for the rest of the class you can remove their name, but make it clear in the rules that removal is at YOUR discretion and not guaranteed. In the UK I only really used this with little kids, but it seems to work well with bratty older kids as well. The advantage is that when they are messing around you can pretty much ignore it. Just write their name up and carry on. The other kids will make sure they know what's happened.

If you have a few kids being really noisy and disruptive, never get into a shouting argument with them, it will just escalate. Instead, walk over to the group and chastise them quietly. It's harder for them to ignore you when you are standing right next to them, and the rest of the class will be quiet because they want to hear them get told off.

Always start strict and ease up once you have control of them. Get the rest of the class involved (i.e. if there are no names on the board for a week, I won't set homework at the weekend, if there are no names for a day, we'll finish early and play a game). If you can get the good kids on your side, they help you do the policing. If you are going to involve the whole class, only ever do it with rewards, not punishment. There is nothing that will turn the whole class against you faster than punishing them all for something a few of them did.

And of course lots of praise and reward for the good kids. As well as the usual stuff, you can try things like play games where sweets are given out for right answers. It gives the ones who do work hard a chance to show off a little and get something back for it.

Apologies if these are really basic, obvious suggestions for you, but in the past they have got me through some very challenging classes. So maybe there is something there you can use. I'm sure other people here must have better suggestions as well.

[naturegirl321]

I had the SAMe probs in Peru. I started teaching there at a uni when I was 22, so I had some students who were older than I was.

I've found that in private schools, kids think they can get away with a lot. My suggestions

1. Talk to the homeroom teacher
2. Put up a rewards and consequences chart in the class
3. Positive reinforce
4. Go to a different school

[spanglish]

PM me. I work at a private colegio in Colombia. We can talk.

[emilyd86]

can you PM me? I guess I haven't written 5 posts yet.

[Prof.Gringo]

[windowlicker]

i think anyone who's taught at a high school in latin america knows where you're coming from. I also hear all the time people saying how much better the behavior is here than in the States...well, it's certainly better to teach at an upper class latin american school than an inner city school in the States, but that's not really a fair comparison, is it?

I find that being strict can often work against you in the Latin American classroom...this is based on limited experience, but I find that by being strict, the entire class will grow to dislike you and collectively work against you. with my students, since they've all been in class together since they were 4 years old, their groups are extremely tight and even if its just a couple students seriously causing problems, you can isolate yourself from the entire class by coming down on them. I've had experiences before where I've gotten angry at a particular student causing problems and told them that the next time I have to call their attention I will give a more formal punishment (involve the school admin.)...then the entire class works together so that different students will scream every time I look in a different direction, so that I can never be 100% certain of who it is doing it at any given time. If I then take the step of assigning extra homework to the entire class for the behavior, either NO ONE will turn it in and I isolate myself even further for giving them all bad grades, or else one student will do it and allow the rest of the class to copy. if the homework has just been assigned out of the book, it's difficult to prove they've copied if it's done correctly, and now instead of punishing them, I've given a good homework grade to students who don't deserve it.

I find it better to create a good relationship with the kids both in and out of the classroom, being fairly lenient with discipline in class, and call in their parents if there are repeated serious problems that talking with the student doesn't fix. remember, this is latin america so they have a pretty informal approach to authority and rules to begin with...sometimes you can just create more problems for yourself here by being extremely strict.

So my approach: dealing with students informally, making a note of times when I've had discussions with students about their behavior and what their behavior was, and calling in parents if that doesn't work, using my notes about their child's behavior to support my concerns.

[emilyd86]

thanks guys! windowlicker, that is exactly how I feel especially in my 8th grade class, which is my toughest group right now. I feel that by being strict they have all turned against me, which makes for an exhausting class and lots of defending myself to the administration. I just want harmony for once! haha. I am surving day by day, I'll try some of these tips

[HLJHLJ]

Perhaps it depends on what you mean by strict. If you are having behaviour problems with many students, and rely heavily on punishment to manage that, then although that is strict, it is liable to upset everyone. If you can design out bad behaviour, or at least minimise it, through forward planning, rather than having to punish it after the fact, you can be strict without the conflict.

Relying on threatening to tell parents opens a whole other can of worms. First you are openly admitting to the students that the 'real' power is further up the line. It reduces you to the level of 'wait until your father gets home', which pretty much removes any illusion of authority. Second, there is no guarantee that the parents will back you, and not side with their golden child.

It is possible to be strict and maintain tight control over a class, without turning yourself into the bad guy, but it's something that has to be worked at.

emilyd86, how much longer do you have to get through?

[fladude]

I have not taught in LA, although I will be next year, but I have taught on a US Native Reservation (where I work now) and I do believe that the kids sound very similar to what you describe. I had a similar problem and solved it by using some of the strategies already described. First I gave a lot of good grades. I assume that since you are at a private school that you already pass everyone. I passed almost everyone as well. The only people I fail are people who never come to school. The guys who show up every day and sleep all day, I pass. Even if they never turn anything in they do in class, I still pass them if the come most of the time and aren't too disruptive. If you are failing people who come to school at least half the time, then stop doing that.

I would step that up and go heavy on positive reinforcement. Give a lot of As, even to people who don't really deserve it. Secondly pick your battles better. You can make them follow certain rules, just not every rule every day. Be smart in your battles. But also act like a total hard*** when it comes to grading. Act like you are the hardest most critical grader on earth, but then give them an A. That's what I did anyway. So at first they thought I was a big jerk who was going to fail all of them, but then they got their results back and everyone was happy. And after that my problems stopped.

[naturegirl321]

Be aware of being a hard grader. the first time I graded essays and found that there was no puncutation and the ENTIRE essay was ONE sentence, not to mention horrible grammar and spelling, I gave the majority of the class Bs. The class tutor's response?

I had to give them another chance. Meaning that they had to re-write their essays and I had to re.mark them. After that, I barely graded, and just gave most As and a couple A pluses.

[just_a_mirage]

Wow, I just realized how really lucky I am to be working at a school that really supports teachers. My boss would kill me if I gave a student a good grade for sub-standard work. And most decent schools here in Guayaquil are the same way. I've worked in several schools from primary to university and all insist on true grades. At the high school where I currently work, they will fail students. We have monthly meetings for each grade level, to discuss students with problems, and strategies to help them. Discipline problems are not tolerated, and the school backs the teachers on this. We have forms that we use to write up any problems that occur in class. The student must then meet with their grade coordinator to explain their behavior. If the problem continues, parents are called, but not by teachers. Grade coordinators deal with that, although teachers may sit in on the meetings. The school is structured but fair. And there are several psychologists who work with students who may be having problems at home or elsewhere. It is a huge school with a couple thousand students but they are doing it right. I used to teach in an inner-city school district in the States, and I would much rather teach in Ecuador.

[Cruiser]