Job Discussion Forums

[jeoconne]

I have been offered a job in China that offers decent pay but only Chinese medical insurance, not western expat medical insurance.

Do any of you have experience purchasing your own medical insurance? Are there any companies that you recommend or that I should avoid?

And for those of you who choose to go only with the Chinese medical insurance: What are your experiences with it? Is it decent enough? Are the low numbers that the contracts cover enough to get care in China? What do you plan to do in case of an emergency?

Thanks in advance.

[MisterButtkins]

Most jobs do not offer 'Western' health insurance. Personally I just got used to the idea of dying if I had any serious health problems. I am now a richer, more reckless man because of this. I feel more alive. The thing is, with 'western medical insurance', unless you go to one of the richie-rich expat hospitals in Beijing or Shanghai, you are still going to have to pay up front in cash. Possibly less cash than you spent on the 'western medical insurance'. And then they might not be able to process your insurance claim or something. Obviously, you are going to need a Chinese-speaker with you to negotiate all this, so hopefully you don't have any medical emergencies while alone.

Right now the company I work for has Chinese insurance for all the foreign teachers and it seems to work okay. Basically, whenever one of the foreign teachers goes to the hospital, the big boss of the company goes in and pays their bill with cash. Then someone who works at our company takes care of the insurance claim, we do not have to worry about it. The kicker is that we have to go to a fairly crappy Chinese hospital, where there are 8 people in each room and not enough nurses.

[The Ever-changing Cleric]

were the nurses nice looking?

[rogerwilco]

[choudoufu]

you might think twice about world nomads.
i was with them, but they switched carriers
to an american company.

the result? emergency heart surgery claim denied.
....they don't cover cosmetic surgery.

current contract provides chinese insurance,
i believe through PICC. we have the option to
decline and receive the equivalent in RMB.

i purchase private insurance to cover emergencies,
as well as repatriation and medical flights.

anything minor i cover myself locally, or can
fly to bangkok or india for something serious.
(still cheaper and safer than flying back to
the us to use the va system)

[jeoconne]

Thanks for the help. Here is a portion of the insurance coverage. Maybe you can help me decipher it.

The limits are so low. I come from the USA where a simple ambulance ride will cost USD800 or RMB5600. Is health care in China really so low that these limits are reasonable?

I have also been looking into HTH Global Citizen plans. Does anyone here have any experience with them? I only want the plan to keep me from going bankrupt in case of an emergency; I do not plan to ever use it if possible. For simple things I would use the Chinese insurance. Although knowing how capitalist insurance companies work, there is a high probability that even in the case of an emergency they would find some excuse to not pay.

Benefit Item Limits (RMB) Explanation

1)Insurance premium for accidental death 100,000 Maximum coverage for accidental death

2)Insurance premium for accidental disablement (Maximum) 100,000 In case of disablement caused by accident, insurance premium will be made according to proportion with RMB100,000 as the limit.

3)Accidental medical insurance premium 10,000 In case of reasonable medical fee entailed by accident exceling RMB100, 100% premium will be paid for the part of the reasonable medical fee beyond RMB100.

4)Insurance premium for outpatient or emergency treatment 15,000/year In case of outpatient treatment entailed by accident or disease, 90% of reasonable medical fee will be paid as premium with RMB400/day as the maximum.

5)Supplementary insurance premium for inpatient treatment 20,000/year In case of inpatient treatment entailed by accident or disease, 90% of reasonable medical fee not compensated by social insurance will be paid as premium.

6)Subsidy for outpatient treatment caused by accident 30/day In case of inpatient treatment entailed by accident, RMB30/day*reasonable days of inpatient treatment will be paid as subsidy.

Thanks.

[Non Sequitur]

PICC (as mentioned by choudoufou above) offer medical and accident cover for about 1500RMB pa.
They have offices all over and you see the big red PICC sign in most cities.
If there are a number of teachers thinking about signing up, I have known the school to arrange for the rep to come to school.
Who pays depends on your package. I have not yet worked for a school that pays.
Preexisting conditions are excluded and from memory the health check that you undertake once in China is taken to be definitive.
On the claims side I don�t have anything to offer. But the PICC hospitalisation is in local Chinese hospitals. Teachers who I know who have been hospitalised describe conditions as �spartan�.

[relaxtischina]

For those of you in Suzhou or Shanghai (not sure what other cities) AIA is another company that offers health insurance although you must take life and disability coverage in the same package.

On a related topic:
Having spent most of last week in a local Suzhou hospital with a broken arm I can say that, overall, I am happy with the care I received. For anyone wondering about some of the differences you may encounter compared to what would likely back home (Australia in my case) I can suggest:

1. It seems all the beds at my hospital where only 180cm long which was way too short for me but wonders can be done with a spare office chair

2. Nurses only administer medication and provide other emergency assistance. Apparently a patients family are required to assist with showering, feeding etc.

3. After the fist x-ray confirming I needed to be admitted to hospital a deposit was required before treatment could begin. Each morning of my stay in hospital a new bill would be presented to us, which, according to my wife needed to be paid for by the end of the day to ensure receiving further treatment

4. The cost of a shared ward (3 share) for accommodation only was 60 rmb per day. The VIP room with internet access a few doors down is charged at 600rmb per day. My level of cover only would pay for up to 150 rmb per day so for me the choice was easy

Anyway hope this helps someone in their planning about health insurance and what it may be like to use the local hospital in-patient service.

[LarssonCrew]

Just to discuss this.

I was sick with a stomach something or other [too much acid...inflamation of kidney and intestines] and went to my local hospital

'Shaanxi people's hospital'.

Went in at around 5am[Icalled my work colleague and she travelled for an hour to help me, bless] and after paying and such, we go to the doctor who says 'No foreigners, you have to go tobuilding 5]' Bare in mind this hospital is shocking and unclean, dirty, smelly, people in there are farmers and it's packed.

So we head there to the new building, and actually,it's a 'foreign owned' facility. Go in and its essentially the same as a hospital in the west.
Short beds though, they treated me, did some tests, and then gave me a bill for 2100 rmb...for 6 hours in a hospital.

Cheap for the west but expensive[I think] for backwards Xian. Anyways, the nurses were friendly enough,did their job, I got better, but upon asking why I was sick, they had no answer and just said 'everytime you are sick, come here'. I can't help thinking that 500 rmb for a room is expensive [can stay in the Hyatt for 600 here!], but then again, it ended up as a private room, although no bathroom, and for me that was important.

Still, even in the 'western owned' hospital that caters 'specifically to westerners', the doctors spoke barely any English, and I ended up using my friend to translate. Also, as noted, if you cannot get up and are on your own you are done for! No help from nurses to get to the bathroom[I had 2 IV sacks to carry], no help with food, or anything. I had to ask my friend to go buy me some water and such.

I can't help thinking that the hospital's price for drugs would be more than a Chinese would pay, even if we are buying from the same place....to be honest, in future if I need a drip with some added drugs, I'd be happy going to the army hospital I went to before where I paid 30 RMB for it, rather than 2100!

Final note, my friend went to the hospital and the doctor gave him a list of drugs heneeded. Ourchinese friend went to the counterinthe hospital and was quoted 400rmb, he quickly left, went to a local pharmacy and got everything for 58rmb.

[jeoconne]

Thanks for all of the help and comments.

You have given me a new idea to think about. It never really occurred to me that even with western expat insurance it would only be useful in big cities like Shanghai, Beijing, Guangzhou, Hong Kong, etc. Everywhere else in China, and I do a lot of traveling so this is important to me, it would be fairly worthless because if anything really happened I would be sent to a local hospital anyway. So maybe there really is no reason to get western expat insurance.

I like the comments that discuss specific experiences with Chinese hospitals. Please keep them coming as it would be nice to have this place be a good resource for Chinese hospital experiences.

And I really do not mind the idea of using Chinese hospitals. I do not mind if they are dirty or loud or chaotic, as long as it will help me get better and not bankrupt me. And clean looking does not mean clean - going into clean-looking hospitals in the west is a dangerous thing to do anymore due to the super-germs that they breed due to the crazy over-use of anti-biotics. And I will also admit that I just cannot trust western capitalist profit-driven medicine anymore. Its only purpose seems to be to bankrupt people. And many times profit-driven insurance is of no use either as it will find any excuse to not pay. It really is a complicated thing to think about.

[YAMARI]

If you live in shanghai or beijing you can have really good western doctors with the right insurance. Look into companies like Bupa, and axa. By the type of insurance package that suits you . Some come with extras like Chiropractic and such. Make sure you ask for direct billing option and full coverage with no co pay( co pay means you pay a percentage.)

If you live out in a small chinese town no point really having insurance other than accident insurance as there wont be any drs you really want to use and if need be local medical costs are quite low. My friend had a baby in Hubei and the whole thing was less than 3000 rmb.

[steve b]

If I may offer my recent experience on this subject?

I was riding my e-bike and came off a very poor second to an articulated lorry, resulting in hospitalisation for three weeks and on top of a gashed and broken hand had to have a 2-hour operation to insert a metal sheet and 7 pins into my upper arm.

The ward had 3 beds and the only English spoken apart from my visiting students was a tiny smattering from a couple of the nurses. Yes the place could have been cleaner, the hospital do not feed you and there was no internet/TV etc. BUT, I managed to smoke and drink so it was not so terrible.

The bill came to around 25,000 rmb which was picked up by my school.

I cannot complain and it was a most interesting episode in my life!

[choudoufu]

don't forget the most important part of ex-pat insurance...

repatriation (of self or remains)

emergency medevac can cost $50K-$100K.

[steve b]

Haha!!

If I croak it I don't care what they do to my remains - I won't be here!!!

[american_inchina]

I have been looking at the insurance websites mentioned above and many others but still have not found what I am looking for. I am just looking for something cheap for emergencies. I found some expat insurance quotes for $170 a month, but I am looking for much cheaper. I really just need something showing continuous coverage until I return home to the US. Does anyone have any ideas?
Thank You!