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Luv2teach
Joined: 02 Mar 2011
Posts: 5
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 Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 5:25 pm Post subject: Where to look for LEGITIMATE/WORTHWHILE jobs/recruiters? |
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Hey, there, everybody!
I'm a newbie and am trying to decipher how to find the legitimate jobs about the world and avoid the horror stories that so many have had.
Soooo, what are the recommended ways/sites to find the legitimate jobs that will not screw you over? I'm ready to go overseas, but all this research for months and months is exhausting, and it seems people don't post where they found the GOOD jobs, or what schools/recruiters were GREAT experiences. HELP!!!!
I understand that everyone can have a very different experience, but every time I find a job I think I'll apply to, I research and find overwhelming "STAY AWAY---SCAM--DON'T WORK THERE'' messages. 
MOD EDIT Most posters seem to think in general it's wise to stay away from recruiters...yes or no? I do have a Bachelor's and a CELTA and years experience teaching ESL already and just want to get hooked up with something worthwhile and legit. I prefer teaching adults as that's what I do in the USA, but it seems more of the positions teaching adults are university positions which require a Master's  , so I may have to end up teaching the kiddies. I'm particularly interested in Asia, Latin America, or UAE (Dubai or Abu Dhabi, perhaps?).
PLEASE GIVE ME YOUR INPUT!!!!!! Great schools to work for (in ANY country) MOD EDITTHANK YOU, guys!!!!!!! |
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Ariadne
Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Posts: 960
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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You mentioned Asia... well there are many universities in China that will hire you without a Masters. Try to contact schools directly, you really don't need a recruiter. Visit the China forum for more info. Keep in mind that there are thousands of schools, each hiring a handful of FTs. It looks as if your qualifications are perfectly good for lots of uni jobs here. The salaries aren't like the ME, but hours and working conditions are often very attractive. It sure works for me.
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Ariadne wrote: |
| You mentioned Asia... well there are many universities in China that will hire you without a Masters. Try to contact schools directly, you really don't need a recruiter. |
I'll second the thought that you should avoid recruiters.
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| Keep in mind that there are thousands of schools, each hiring a handful of FTs. It looks as if your qualifications are perfectly good for lots of uni jobs here. |
China perhaps, but not in most other places.
Entry level jobs usually mean conversation schools or ALT work.
You said Asia. Ok, where specifically? It's a big place.
And when are you thinking of starting to teach? You want to teach only adults, so that eliminates a huge chunk of jobs (ALT, for one). The conversation schools in Japan hire year round, but not all of them do that. Most tend to hire in Feb/March more than any other time for the April start dates.
Doing research is time-consuming and painstaking. I remember when I started out. Collect info and lurk to see what people say about job hunting. Then, if you see an ad that appears attractive but gives you some doubt, post specific questions. Otherwise, it's just too difficult for people to say, "Go here for ads from reliable employers". |
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Luv2teach
Joined: 02 Mar 2011
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, Ariadne and Glenski, for responding so far.
I was in China a few weeks ago, so that is definitely one of the places where I'm looking. My boss said it was awesome when she worked in Thailand. Lots of people on here say that Vietnam is good, too. Point is, I'm a newbie, and just want to avoid the traps, and not really sure if there are more direct avenues I should take rather than the HOURS upon HOURS of research I've been doing!
I much prefer teaching adults, but I suppose if the children are well-behaved (NOT like our American children--I would NEVER teach them again!) then perhaps that would be OK.
It would also be great to be able to save some $$, i.e. so that I could comfortably satisfy my financial obligations in the States whilst in the other country working. I've heard that South K. was the place by which I could accomplish that, but I do not believe I can get a Uni. job without a Masters and I'd prefer to avoid hagwons. Not sure what the ''teaching adults'' sitch is there, but, as I said, perhaps kids, or teens will be ok as long as there are minimal behaviour probs. |
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tttompatz
Joined: 06 Mar 2010
Posts: 1951
Location: Talibon, Bohol, Philippines
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| Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 12:09 am Post subject: |
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| Luv2teach wrote: |
Thanks, Ariadne and Glenski, for responding so far.
I was in China a few weeks ago, so that is definitely one of the places where I'm looking. My boss said it was awesome when she worked in Thailand. Lots of people on here say that Vietnam is good, too. Point is, I'm a newbie, and just want to avoid the traps, and not really sure if there are more direct avenues I should take rather than the HOURS upon HOURS of research I've been doing!
I much prefer teaching adults, but I suppose if the children are well-behaved (NOT like our American children--I would NEVER teach them again!) then perhaps that would be OK.
It would also be great to be able to save some $$, i.e. so that I could comfortably satisfy my financial obligations in the States whilst in the other country working. I've heard that South K. was the place by which I could accomplish that, but I do not believe I can get a Uni. job without a Masters and I'd prefer to avoid hagwons. Not sure what the ''teaching adults'' sitch is there, but, as I said, perhaps kids, or teens will be ok as long as there are minimal behaviour probs. |
First, let's clarify some points.
Teaching adults in Asia typically means either working in a University (outside of China usually means a masters) or working when they are not at work (ugly split shifts - early am and late pm).
Recruiters and agents. They are different.
An agent hires you, farms you out to a school and takes a piece of your salary as their cut. Typically the school pays them and they pay you. They are nasty and not a place I would want to work for. In Thailand and China you will find that the majority of "horror stories: come from situations like this.
A recruiter is different. They are a headhunter. They are hired by the school to locate and screen potential candidates for the school who then hires the applicant. The recruiter is paid a one-time fee by the school and is then out of the picture.
Really, when it comes to a recruiter, who cares?
A recruiter is nothing more than an introduction to an employer.
REPEAT: A recruiter is nothing more than an introduction to an employer.
Hello Mr. English speaker this is Mr school owner/director/DOS.
Mr. school owner/director/DOS, this is Mr. English speaker.
Mr. English speaker, here is the contract. Please read and sign.
School, here is the signed contract. Pay me.
Good bye.
-You are not paying the recruiter anything (or you shouldn't be).
-THEY DO NOT WORK FOR YOU! - They work for the school.
-They owe you nothing once you get there.
-They are not your friend.
-They are not your baby sitter.
-They cannot help you if things go to *beep* after you get there - EVEN IF their fancy website says differently.
Beyond that it is YOUR responsibility to check the school out.
Do NOT trust ANY recruiter. They are like used car salesmen. They will lie and sell their soul to get the signature on the contract. You walk onto their lot and look at what they have on offer. If there is something you see that you like you inquire further and make your own good judgment about whether or not to proceed with the purchase from there.
Do your own DUE DILIGENCE in regards to the school or get burned.
Use the recruiters for what they are; a bridge between you and an employer that you would otherwise be unable to find.
Use more than one and keep going until you find the job you want, in the location you want, with the benefits that you want.
There is no rush and there is certainly no shortage of jobs in ESL globally.
When it comes to the school - again - repeat - Do your own DUE DILIGENCE.
1st - READ the contract over very carefully. If that doesn't scare you away then...
The best you can do is minimize the risk by talking to MORE THAN ONE of the foreign staff and ask POINTED AND SPECIFIC QUESTIONS (*when the boss is NOT listening over their shoulder). Don't accept non-specific answers and broad generalizations.
No foreign staff references to talk (directly and via e-mail when the boss is NOT looking over their shoulder) to = walk away now.
Accept NO EXCUSES for any reason.
BIG NOTE HERE:
A recruiter is NOT an employment or dispatch or temp agency who sends you out to different jobs and charges a portion of your salary as a fee.
They are a head-hunter who finds an employee for an employer and once that is done they are out of the picture.
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7777 |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 4:00 am Post subject: |
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Recruiters can be good, but more often than not, they're look after themselves. With your quals and experience, you should be able to apply directly to schools. Asia has lots of adverts, check out
eslcafe.com
seriousteachers
higheredjobs
chronicle
tesol.org |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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| tttompatz wrote: |
First, let's clarify some points.
Teaching adults in Asia typically means either working in a University (outside of China usually means a masters) or working when they are not at work (ugly split shifts - early am and late pm). |
Furthermore, university age students here in Japan are terribly immature, perhaps 5 years below their physical age. Really think hard about that. Those young "adults" are glorified HS kids (emphasis on kids).
If you want to teach business people, you have 2 initial choices:
1. Get hired directly by the company that needs teachers.
2. Get hired by a business English agency that holds its own lessons in-house or farms you out to the clients.
Either way, you will often/usually need some experience in the field that the clients are in, so that the lingo/jargon/terminology isn't so new to you that you waste everyone's time picking it up before you can even teach the language. |
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