Job Discussion Forums

[NilsA]

I will be getting my TESOL Certificate this fall/winter and will be new to the job market next year. I would most like to teach in Japan, and am wondering how difficult it is to get a job in Japan (particularly as a newbie) compared to China or Korea. I would like to know where I am going to go ahead of time so that I can begin learning the language. Any input on this subject, or advice in general, would be greatly appreciated.

[Glenski]

You should post this in the Japan forum, but as long as I'm here...

Most Japanese employers don't care or know much about certification, especially for entry level jobs. Got a degree? That's usually enough for them.

Nowadays, the market here is very tight, so maybe -- just maybe -- adding certification will help, but I don't think so in all cases. There are still plenty of employers who just want a green foreigner.

I think that China and Korea have a bit more lax standards for hiring, but those shouldn't be the only thing you consider about those countries. Work conditions and xenophobia and unscrupulous employers should also be on your mind.

Example: In Korea, you don't have the right to keep your visa if you lose your job. In Japan, you do.

When are you hoping to start teaching?

[NilsA]

Thanks for the prompt reply! I do have a degree, in English literature. I will not be looking to start a job overseas until next summer, or fall if that fits the education schedule better. So I have lots of time to sort things out.

Mainly I would love to know where I am going to go ahead of time so that I can begin studying the language. I don't have to go to Japan; everywhere in Asia is interesting, and as you point out, there are all kinds of considerations. I would be happy going to Korea or China. I have heard China requires 2 years experience to get a work visa, and while I know that can be gotten around, it might make it less of a sure thing for a first job in TESOL.

Anyway, I have no teaching experience yet, so I'm just trying to get a sense of what country might be the strongest bet to start out with. I'm hoping to avoid doing something like spending the next year studying Japanese and then ending up in Thailand...

Thanks again for your reply, and if you have any more advise I'm hungry for information!

[Glenski]

[NilsA]

Ah, you caught that. Yes, "advice." For an English major/prospective teacher to seek "advise" would be rather ironic. I will go to the Japan forum and read the FAQ stickies. I will also investigate JET program. Thank you for pointing me in a direction.

My tentative schedule is based mainly on my timetable for getting TESOL certified, and if Japanese employers don't much care about that certification than there's no reason for me to wait. I get the sense that getting a job in Japan is a bit of a long shot, but there's no harm in trying.

So far as important information goes, I'm still trying to figure out what my questions are. I'm in uncharted territory with this ESL business, so I apologize for not yet knowing what to ask. Honestly, given my credentials (or lack thereof), I would mainly just like to get a sense of where in Asia I might have the best chance of getting a good first job. To do this I clearly need to figure out exactly what my considerations are (for example, I know that quality of experience--for me and for my students--is much more important to me than how much money I make).

Many of my questions thus do not apply specifically to Japan. I began my query there because, all else being equal (which of course it isn't), Japan would be my first choice of places to work and live. You have given me some useful information, and I will post any further Japan related questions I might have in the Japan forum. Meanwhile I will keep perusing all the forums, gathering information wherever I can, and when I manage to sort out a good collection of specific questions I will start a new post.

Thanks again for your input (I'm afraid to say "advice" now!), and I hope all is going well for you there.

[naturegirl321]

It's easy to find a job in most places, but getting agood job is hard. As Glenski says, and he's the Japan expert, the market is flooded, so salaries are lower. Most newbies head to Korea or CHina first to get experience. Even then, it's hard to break in, since once you're no longer a newbie, you want a good job and that's hard to get in Japan without publications in Japanese magazines, speaking the language, and contacts.

[NilsA]

I have been thinking that China might be a good option for me to start. I won't hesitate to apply for jobs in Japan, but I can see that I should keep other options open. I'm not expecting to make a ton of money; I'm more interested in having a quality experience in a place that interests me. And China certainly interests me!

I am a very flexible, adaptable kind of person, and I feel up to the challenge. But I have run into a few people saying that to get a work visa in China you have to have 2 years experience, and I'm a newbie. Do you know if this is true? Realistically, how hard is it likely to be for me to get a job in China as a newbie? If I felt I had reason to be reasonably confident (and I'm willing and able to go after things with considerable enthusiasm), I would start learning Chinese now.

By the way, I am a 41 year old American guy. I imagine myself to be quite youthful and presentable! In case any of that is relevant.

Thank you both, naturegirl321 and Glenski (is your name Glen, and do you like to ski?)--it warms my heart that there are people willing to take the time to be so helpful to a newbie like myself. It's a little daunting trying to map out a clear picture of my prospects in ESL, and I greatly appreciate the guidance and, well, the moral support.

[naturegirl321]

China's rules are pretty flexible. Check the China forum. They had the two year rule when I was there and my boss just fudged my CV and bribed some people.

China's a pretty easy place to start in. SO is Korea. And Taiwan.