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RobertH
Joined: 05 Jun 2011
Posts: 10
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 Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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Good luck to you Mamainak. I think it's a shame that people with CELTAs but no degree and non-native speakers struggle so much in the job market, because in my experience/observation having a degree and being a native speaker aren't that important. Having good communicative skills and being able to plan and organise are more important, and the best teacher on my course was a non-native speaker. Be careful as a non-native speaker with your grammar though (I can see one example there in your post - 'advice' is not countable, so it should be "if you have any advice").
Unfortunately at the moment British Council accreditation requires most teachers to have a degree, or extensive TEFL experience in lieu of this, plus CELTA. This limits your options for most schools but you could still try calling summer schools etc where vacancies might open up later in summer and they may accept people without degrees. If not, you can always carry on volunteering for now, get some hours under your belt and then try again next year. Did you apply to many schools and what did they tell you? |
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RobertH
Joined: 05 Jun 2011
Posts: 10
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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By the way, five year degrees? What exactly do Mexicans do in all that time? Personally, I thought my three-year degree course was pretty leisurely.  |
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Mamainak
Joined: 27 May 2011
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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Ah, yes, for some reason 'advice' is one one of the mistakes I still make. I usually re-read whatever I'm writing and correct mistakes, but this time I didn't.
Actually, I didn't apply to any of the schools here in Britain because the chances of getting a job are practically non-existent. Maybe I could get a job in a summer camp but I still have a job and can't just drop it for a summer job. I'll stick with this job until I get a proper opportunity to teach, probably somewhere abroad as Europe has limitations.
Last edited by Mamainak on Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:53 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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BadBeagleBad
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Isla Guapa wrote: |
| Well, that's interesting but I wonder how all those Mexicans who have real licenciaturas in English-language teaching will feel about this. What Mexican university issues these so-called degrees? How on earth can a four-week course like a CELTA be at all equivalent to a 5-year degree, which is how long it takes to get a licenciatura in Mexico? It sounds weird to me. |
I can�t imagine how a one month course could convert into a 4 year degree. I have a 4 year degree from a university in the US and had a heck of a time getting them to accept THAT. I think it is more likely that it will be recognized as a Teacher�s Diploma, which, while usually a 6 month or so course, is probably roughly equivilent to a CELTA, though there are a lot more observation and teaching hours. It is inconceivable to me that a course that is less than a SEP recognized Teacher�s Diploma would somehow zoom ahead and be worth a 4 year degree. |
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BadBeagleBad
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Isla Guapa wrote: |
| naturegirl321 wrote: |
"baccilarato" is before you're thesis, then you have a "titulo" once you do your thesis. I'm sure I spelt those wrong though.
Personally, I think five years is a waste of time, if they went to secondary school for a year longer and had 12 years of education instead of 11, it would be much better. They'd be more mature. |
That's interesting. In Mexico the bachillerato is what you get after finishing prepa, I believe. Most university degrees take 5 years, but you can't call yourself licenciado/a till you finish your tesis. Until you do, you are a mere pasante. So many people never finish the tesis, that some universities are reconsidering requiring one, so that more people will actually graduate! |
And, in Mexico, you have to do a year of social service for most majors, which can be done at the same time, as you are finishing up your degree, or afterwards. And, more and more universities are requiring a certain score on the TOEFL or the TOEIC in order to graduate. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| is before you're thesis, |
Native speakers make errors too, especially when typing quickly. I'm not innocent either.  |
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Guy Courchesne
Joined: 10 Mar 2003
Posts: 9650
Location: Mexico City
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:40 am Post subject: |
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| BadBeagleBad wrote: |
| Isla Guapa wrote: |
| Well, that's interesting but I wonder how all those Mexicans who have real licenciaturas in English-language teaching will feel about this. What Mexican university issues these so-called degrees? How on earth can a four-week course like a CELTA be at all equivalent to a 5-year degree, which is how long it takes to get a licenciatura in Mexico? It sounds weird to me. |
I can�t imagine how a one month course could convert into a 4 year degree. I have a 4 year degree from a university in the US and had a heck of a time getting them to accept THAT. I think it is more likely that it will be recognized as a Teacher�s Diploma, which, while usually a 6 month or so course, is probably roughly equivilent to a CELTA, though there are a lot more observation and teaching hours. It is inconceivable to me that a course that is less than a SEP recognized Teacher�s Diploma would somehow zoom ahead and be worth a 4 year degree. |
This is the presentation IH made at the Mextesol convention in late May, if you recall seeing it on the program. Apparently SEP is accepting the CELTA (and the TKT as well as a host of other teacher training courses) and will issue a licenciatura on it. There's more to it though. They are doing this for people over a certain age (I plan to check into what the age is) and that have several years verifiable teaching experience. They also ask for reference letters from employers.
A friend of mine in DF is going through the process now with SEP after having completed a TKT course and this comes from her, though I do plan to check into it. I'm told it takes a year for the full process to bear out. |
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Isla Guapa
Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 1520
Location: Mexico City o sea La Gran Manzana Mexicana
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:06 am Post subject: |
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| Guy Courchesne wrote: |
| BadBeagleBad wrote: |
| Isla Guapa wrote: |
| Well, that's interesting but I wonder how all those Mexicans who have real licenciaturas in English-language teaching will feel about this. What Mexican university issues these so-called degrees? How on earth can a four-week course like a CELTA be at all equivalent to a 5-year degree, which is how long it takes to get a licenciatura in Mexico? It sounds weird to me. |
I can�t imagine how a one month course could convert into a 4 year degree. I have a 4 year degree from a university in the US and had a heck of a time getting them to accept THAT. I think it is more likely that it will be recognized as a Teacher�s Diploma, which, while usually a 6 month or so course, is probably roughly equivilent to a CELTA, though there are a lot more observation and teaching hours. It is inconceivable to me that a course that is less than a SEP recognized Teacher�s Diploma would somehow zoom ahead and be worth a 4 year degree. |
This is the presentation IH made at the Mextesol convention in late May, if you recall seeing it on the program. Apparently SEP is accepting the CELTA (and the TKT as well as a host of other teacher training courses) and will issue a licenciatura on it. There's more to it though. They are doing this for people over a certain age (I plan to check into what the age is) and that have several years verifiable teaching experience. They also ask for reference letters from employers.
A friend of mine in DF is going through the process now with SEP after having completed a TKT course and this comes from her, though I do plan to check into it. I'm told it takes a year for the full process to bear out. |
I wonder why SEP is doing this. It is certainly a slap in the face of someone like Teresa who has a four-year teaching degree, or even someone with a two-year degree from a normal. Maybe it's an easy way to upgrade the credentials of teachers without making them do much to merit the upgrade. Then the SEP can boast about the high percentage of teachers in Mexico who have university degrees. I wonder if it's the brainchild of the teachers union and their devious leader Elba Esther. |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:08 am Post subject: |
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SEP is what?
Is MExico like Peru where they only have grades 1 to 11, so then uni is 5 years? |
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AGoodStory
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 738
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:43 pm Post subject: |
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| naturegirl321 wrote: |
SEP is what?
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Secretaria de Educaci�n P�blica--Mexico's Ministry of Education |
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BadBeagleBad
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Guy Courchesne wrote: |
This is the presentation IH made at the Mextesol convention in late May, if you recall seeing it on the program. Apparently SEP is accepting the CELTA (and the TKT as well as a host of other teacher training courses) and will issue a licenciatura on it. There's more to it though. They are doing this for people over a certain age (I plan to check into what the age is) and that have several years verifiable teaching experience. They also ask for reference letters from employers.
A friend of mine in DF is going through the process now with SEP after having completed a TKT course and this comes from her, though I do plan to check into it. I'm told it takes a year for the full process to bear out. |
I do recall seeing it, but didn�t look at it very closely since I already have a degree. What you are saying makes more sense than just CELTA equals degree. I�d be interested in knowing exactly how that works, I know some people who would probably be interested. Or will have to look for that workshop in the future, I am sure they will be in Morelia in October. Are you going? You�ll have your new little one right about then, won�t you? |
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BadBeagleBad
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Isla Guapa wrote: |
I wonder why SEP is doing this. It is certainly a slap in the face of someone like Teresa who has a four-year teaching degree, or even someone with a two-year degree from a normal. Maybe it's an easy way to upgrade the credentials of teachers without making them do much to merit the upgrade. Then the SEP can boast about the high percentage of teachers in Mexico who have university degrees. I wonder if it's the brainchild of the teachers union and their devious leader Elba Esther. |
Knowing the SEP like I (unfortunately) do, I think it will take the year that Guy pointed out, or more. It took me months to do what was supposed to be a pretty straightforward recognition of a foreign 4 year degree. Now a degree from a Normal being recognized as a 4 year degree after a few years of experience doesn�t bother me, I have know some Normalista teachers who were quite good. But the reason behind it, I believe, is new requirement for High School teachers in SEP recognized schools (which for all pratical purposes is pretty much every school, public or private) to have a Licenciature, amoung other things. It is not working out quite the way they thought it would. There is a severe shortage of teachers. They were accepting applications earlier in the year, then a couple of months after the deadline opened it back up. They didn�t even get enough APPLICATIONS to fill open positions, much less pick and choose. So here�s your chance, Troll, to work for the SEP. They are desperate, so they might hire even you. |
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BadBeagleBad
Joined: 23 Aug 2010
Posts: 1186
Location: 24.18105,-103.25185
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| Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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| naturegirl321 wrote: |
SEP is what?
Is MExico like Peru where they only have grades 1 to 11, so then uni is 5 years? |
SEP is the Mexican Public Education secretary, the vast majority of private schools - on all levels - are also recognized, as are language schools, beauty schools, etc. Mexican schools are divided into primaria which is grades 1-6, secundaria, 7-9 and preparatoria 10 - 12. There are also loads of pre-school and kindergarden programs, both public and private. Uni is 5 years for most people because there is a year of social service required as part of the requirement to get your degree. |
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