Job Discussion Forums

ChinaBus · Joined: 01 Feb 2011 Posts: 11

What precautionary measures can you have written into the contract in case things go bad with your employer and you want to cut from that school and go to another without a bad wrap on the national database? Question

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

Laurence · Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 401

the best precautionary measure anyone can take

is to bring enough money to assure a short-notice, safe passage home if needed

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

That would be an interesting clause in the contract!
'Party B shall at all time hold sufficient funds in cash as to facilitate what is colloquially known as a "runner" to his/her home country'.
'Party A is aware that through the insertion of this clause it is acknowledging that no matter what may be written or stated, it reserves the right to unilaterally refuse, decline, renege, insult, mislead or in any other way not perform any duty or obligation stated herein'.

ChinaBus · Joined: 01 Feb 2011 Posts: 11

Maybe theres a misunderstanding, im asking concerning if the school does not hold up their end of the contract, a clause that leaves it open to seek work elsewhere in the country. An opening to seek reasonable employment with a more ethical company.

Silent Shadow · Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:39 am Post subject:

Non Sequitur · Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 4724 Location: China

There is no misunderstanding.
The idea that an individual teacher can change anything in a standard contract, let alone insert clauses that protect her/him against abuse, is well.. 'naive' to my eyes.
No offense OP but even a cursory reading of Dave's would show you that.
As poster above says and please heed the advice. Check how people are actually treated and don't accept anything (at least as far as your first job is concerned) that can't be independently verified. Former teachers are best.
Best

The Great Wall of Whiner · Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 4946 Location: Blabbing

I would suggest reading any contract carefully before you sign on.

That's the only advice I have, although both teachers and schools are known to break contracts.

dean_a_jones · Joined: 03 Jul 2009 Posts: 1151 Location: Wuhan, China

Agree that the best protection is active detective work before signing, including speaking to as many current teachers (and others) as possible. If it is a decent sized place, try to find the expat forums for that city as well to see if you can link with people who used to work there etc. Not 100%, and as you can see on this site often you hear from those with the worst experience, who may have made their own lives difficult, but should give a reasonable picture.

In terms of the contract, I am not sure adding a clause will help much if your fear is that the employer does not uphold the rest of the contract--surely they will just ignore that as well.

Having said that, it is the appendix that counts, rather than the SAFEA contract, so see what they have added. My current appendix contract has a western style 2 months notice period to terminate employment at any point. It has been used by one teacher, but he did leave between semesters, which makes it a lot easier in terms of getting a replacement. But it at least demonstrates it can work. Clearly however, the ease of using this relies on the good faith of the school, and you should be doing as much as you can to try to figure out what kind of people you will be working for.

Lobster · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:39 am Post subject:

7969 · Joined: 26 Mar 2003 Posts: 5782 Location: Coastal Guangdong

igorG · Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Posts: 1473 Location: asia

It seems the two of you are riding a fancy bike on forums again.

Many experienced FTs have negotiated "stuff" into their contracts too, haven't they? You make the "stuff" sound so easy. You must be such a great teacher.

Lobster · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:18 am Post subject:

Read carfully! The changes are not to the boilerplate contrat, they are to the appendix.I make no claim to being "the best". I am just patient, reliable and good at what I do. How do I change their minds? By explaining that the clauses are either vague, unbalanced or unacceptable, and by giving rational reasons. I go through any prospective contract line by line. It's all ABC:

Acceptable: e.g. class size and student age
Balanced: e.g. breach penalties and notice requirements
Clear: e.g. is airfare reimbursement tax-free

Look, you won't know whether you can do it unless you keep trying. FTs who don't are just opening themselves up to the kinds of abuses we read about here too often.

RED

igorG · Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Posts: 1473 Location: asia

That clears the air.

Lobster · Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:50 am Post subject:

So what's the problem? What's with the sarcastic questions? They really require answers? OK.

It's all ABC, isn't it? Yes, it is. Revising a contract isn't that difficult. Do you find it difficult? Why?

The experiened ones read carfully, don't they? Yes, they do. The inexperienced or lazy take whatever crap they're handed and then complain about it later. Are you willing to learn how to do this?

You are good at what you do, aren't you? Yes, I am or so I'm told. I've been doing this job for over 16 years. My university background is in EFL. I've worked in the classroom and in management in the west and in China. Are you good at teaching? Do you know what you're doing? Do you consider yourself of any value to an employer?

The fact is, that no matter how good one is, s/he may and will get scr*wed somewhere down the road.

May, not will. So what? The idea is to reduce your chances of getting screwed, not just accept it as a given. I got shafted on my first job here, and I'm going to do whatever I can to prevent that from happening again. Will you?

Well, unless, you are ready to s*ck up and become a white puppet to a local "educator" that knows little about education of the subject called English.

Or unless you're willing to stand up and try to defend yourself. My boss doesn't have to be an expert on English teaching. That's why he hires Foreign Experts. He has to be good at recruiting, managing the Chinese staff, dealing with the gov't and landlord and a host of other things.

No matter, I can see where you're going with this, so not much point trying to help you. I don't understand why you'd even want to stay in China. You want to be a victim looking for an accident? You figure you've been shafted and it's inevitable that you'll be shafted again. That's the kind of attitude you want to bring to every job?

Sorry, lots of FTs have done grunt work and were bashed around before they found a good gig. They stuck it out and learned how to get what they want. Now they have good jobs and are happy. Is that so hard to believe? Others just give up, turn tail and run. Choose for yourself now and save yourself from more grief.

RD